Another 350gp questions

The only way the untrained eye would tell them apart would be extremely different # plate colours, bike colours or ban fairings in one of the classes. Maybe the third combined class can run half fairings. :up:
I really don't have a problem with the way it is now, I think Mongo was just trying to clarify one thing, the frame bracing, and now it is all out of control.
Like I said before, the nature of a racer is to improve and go faster, wether it be through rider skill and/or machine setup. Half the fun of racing is building something cool. (the other half is beer and pie).

 

CharlieY, Sounds great. You got this nut's vote.

 

charliey,

you lost my vote a long time ago.......

why do you have such a problem with frame bracing?

i must do my due diligence and submit my own rules proposal concerning cb350 stockers to wera for 350gp. wonder what my first point might be?

work on your argument, cause this whole thread turned witch-hunt has gotten out of hand.

no one like conjecture and speculation thrown around without the hard facts to support it.....to that i mean your comment on how you received a couple of emails in support of prohibiting frame bracing.

bye-bye, good luck, see you trackside.

may the best argument win!

tex mawby, #61x wera, uscra, vrra, ahrma

 

Thanx Brad....sorry Mongo.

SUMMARY of changes: remainder the same.

Restrictions: OEM frame / Swingarm bracing not allowed.

Removals Allowed: Starter, Charging system, Kickstarter, chokes from stock carbs.

Additions Allowed: any non-reservoir hydraulic shocks, neck roller bearing conversion.

Mods Allowed: Welding of lap joint edges on OEM frame components originally joined by OEM factory spot welds, repairing a cracked original weld or frame / swingarm. removal of "street oriented" tabs and brackets.

And this....Any modifications not specifically listed above shall not be permitted.

thats it.

 

10-4 tex....I already have....bracing doesnt meet the current rule. Validation to justify a change lies with you sir.

Your proposal I'm guessing is pretty close with one exception, which would change the current rule....a cut and paste job maybe?

My proposal just clarifies the current rule, no change. ...and adds a few things that are reality, yours probably does too.

You odviously never had my vote on this topic sir. I said I had an email saying the braces should be required to be cut off....and I do, but it dont matter....I also think you might be surprised....but hey, thats between me and him.

Why dont you just bring the bike you just bought and run it?

Like I said earlier, I'm not opposed to a season waiver for joes bike....but you guys never answered the question....how many braced bikes are we looking at?....???.....we have ZERO....nadda.

Lay your cards on the tables sir.....I have....how many bikes will not meet the current or clarified rule?

 

I would also add aftermarket tanks allowed.

 

yeah, the green bike is mine. i didnt realize it had made such an impact. look, im not against changing the rules, or anything. i feel like its actually tottaly out of my control. and here is the exact reason i never read it the way you guys do. because the motor part of the gp rules explicitly say "no material removed or added". however, there is no wording addressing that concerning the frame. to me it is there with relation to one aspect, but not the other. ie, motor, not frame. so either it was intentionally leaving a hole, or forgotten about. as i understood it, talking to 2 people involved, it was never addressed as it was felt it would make no real difference against the true gp bikes. and i honestly think in preservation of the class, those bikes should have a performance benefit.

the reason i take issue with changing the rule is because i dont thik it needs to be done. if doug bowie, or roper, or any of those other guys were getting their asses handed to them by braced cb350's, to preserve the intent of the class, it would be and should be addressed. i feel like until that time happens, there is really no point to changing anything.

as far as from trackside, i think you would ave a very difficult time seeing my braces as my legs obstruct them. the bracing on chris m's bike is very obvious even at 80mph. fairings were illegal for 350gp hondas in wera up until 2 seasons ago i believe. i dont think there is anyone in ma or ne running a full fairing as of now on a cb. number plates would best differentiate the classes. i dont really get what the point of that would be though other than for spectators and people who dont know exactly what they are looking at.

you mentioned my bike looks mechanically identical to buffs. well, they are both motorcycles ya know! but i would differ. buffs running a 130 rear, me a 110. buffs running huge mikuni carbs, mine are stock. buff runs a full fairing, i do not. i can look at the bikes and know exactly what classes its legal in. a couple of small metal pipes would not be what id look for. and i guess i see it from the other side. if it didnt have bracing, and stock carbs, but had a built motor, there would be nothing to visually separate them. so lumping anything with a braced frame into one class does not mean its only legal for that class really. yeah, i have a glass tank, and seat, and pvl, and 1000 bucks into my front wheel too. i just took your comment about it looking like buffs to mean, we all have to run shit boxes to make it real stock racing. and i just wont anymore. and yes, my bike is new and nice, but i consider buffs bikes as nice visually if not nicer. it just seemed all of a sudden that you were drawing a $$ line there and that seemed very very unfair. especially since i looked at and drooled all over toe cutters brake at summit. oh my!

so, if i mount my battery on my frame bracing, can i call it a battery box???:up:

jc

 

Sounds like you guys want to build a v-1 bike but don't really want to run v-1?

 

Yeah Joe....its a sweet bike. Its made an impact.

Bare in mind I didnt say "Identical" to Buffs...I said mechanically they look the same...I could go back and quote, but ahhhh...it was more that your bike appears to be at that level, and not at the level we are, thats what I meant....more of a compliment really....no offense intended at all sir.:up:

I know where Buff stands on this issue, and thats OK....lets also say that Buffs last rule proposal (Nov?) was to use Mikuni's in 350GP. Odviously, he has a different vision for our class.....and it sounds like V1 to me, thats all I'm saying....I'll see him soon and we can discuss it, or not...eithers OK, and I believe its his turn to buy.....buff?

The rule would need to be changed to allow bracing, not disallow it....its not listed as allowed....but...

I hear ya on the backdoor....I think that will be fixed by including the statement from FCB....Any modifications not specifically listed above shall not be permitted. This closes the bottom or backdoor.

Hey man, how many bikes are we talking about as being braced? Yours only? yours + 10?...yours +2?

If its just you....I'd help and sign a waiver request...1 season or something....Then I'll tell ya what, I've got a bone stock frame sittin in the garage that you could swap to.....its your if you need it.

 

Thanx Tim:up:

 

yeah, i guess it has made an impact. its made exactly 2 wera race weekends, 4 races, it ran like dogshit its first outting, then ran out of gas its 2nd race after running in 2nd. then it got slowly better the following weekend to the point i think i took a 3rd. but its only shown up 2x at summit. once at nhis, and at mid where it barely made the track!

i mean, i know you cant miss it in the pits.....but i never would have thought!

jc

 

Joe...have you done anything else to your swingarm besides the bearing mod?

 

And Mongo:up:

 

mikunis i think should stay out of gp for cb350's. that opens waay too many doors i think. i would consider cb450 cv carbs though. but even then, i see no problems with the rules the way they are. i have piles of frames but thanks for the offer.

its funny you can draw a parallel between my bikes and buffs. because about 8 or 9 years ago my old bike was at sears with my buddy mike riding it. he went out from boston with todd. it was the weekend of todds accident. and those of you who didnt know todd before his accident missed out on a really unique personality. anyway, my old bike is there, pitted near todds setup, and mikes coming in from practice. an hes just complaining about the brake. (stock with vb linings.) so todd looks at my bike and goes, "what brake?" kinda funny. but another comment he made, that i think is funny because of what you said was by todd. he said "its obvious an artist put that bike together because a mechanic sure didnt"

progression.

jc

 

no comment. its out there. lets just say its a stock part, stock length and i never did any major surgery to it nor has it been braced or welded on at all. but im not putting my foot in the shit again.


jc

 

mongo, i dont think anyone is saying it is necessary. it certainly isnt. and i think the motor is what makes it a v1 bike.

before rules changes are considered, i think the intent of the inclusion of the cb350s into gp should be considered. thats whats important here. the other bikes should be the stars of the show. they should be favored if just slightly. we are there as a support cast. i think its about making sure the grids are full enough to legitimize those bikes being out there. at least until those riders are comfortable with the grid sizes, or see an unfair advantage. thats what i think. were trying to make rules changes for a class we dont even technically belong in. it should be the ducatis, and aeros, and whatever else shows up that should be picking on us.

jmho

jc

 

and i think its a great class for that. i dont think making more frame restrictions for that class for those bikes is the right thing to do yet. i think the motor limitations, are enough. for now. like i said before, if braced framed cb350's were running away with it, then there would have to be something thought of. my opinion. how long since they were let into the class? how many braced cbs have there been? by accounting here, maybe 6 tops. none of them have taken even a regional championship. my best finish was 3rd in 500 i think and im not sure that was on chris' braced bike. i think it was on my own clapped out piece of junk. and i cant attriubute that to frame bracing. and i certainly cant attribute to my ability as a rider as i know im definitely not the most talented out there. and if i did it on chris' bike, i wish i could have showed you that motor. literally from a $150 junker swap meet buy. i wasnt exaggerating when i said mouse turds.

jc