It started as a joke but unfortunately it is true.

When the attacks on Iraq began, I asked where Dubya' was more likely to be heading - Texas or Camp David? I was only kidding. There was no way that I figured His Higness would scamper out of D.C. for some R&R so quickly after engaging the U.S. in its first preemptive attack on a soverign country. How wrong I was. Where is Dubya' this weekend? Camp David. No problem though because the people who are REALLY behind this attack are still in D.C. overseeing events - Paul Wolfowitz and Donald Rumsfeld.

Even the wacko conservatives among you would have to admit that this sends a strange message regardless of how much contact the prez can have from Camp David.

 

i really couldn't care less..

What really pisses me off is how we have these old farts "instrumanting" the war...while US is sending these brainwashed 18 and 19 year old kids out there to die...

Most of these kids don't even know WTF is going on.

Dicks. Get off your ass, and you do the hard work instead of taking the glory for someone's sacrifices.

 

Dad, DC has very little to do with directing the war. You need to watch Arlington, McLean, and some other NoVa towns to see where the true direction of battle is coming from.
DC is nothing but a figurehead of the US goverment.

 

Re: i really couldn't care less..

They had there chance when they were 18 and 19. You've heard of "Chickenhawks", right? If not, here is the website:

http://www.nhgazette.com/chickenhawks.html

 

What, that he should be in the Oval Office micro-managing the war like Lyndon Johnson? That's Tommy Franks' job!

 

That's nonsense. The message in Dubya' heading out of town is that he isn't that critical of a person in the war or that it just isn't important enough for him to stick around.

When the team is working overtime the boss should stick around. Even if he isn't directly involved, it gives the wrong message if he heads out of town for a weekend vacation while the grunts bust their asses.

 

Rat-a-tat-a-dad, once again we are of very different opinion on something.
What difference does it make if GW meets with his advisors in an office in DC or a meeting room in Maryland? Camp David isn't some little cabin with no electricity up on some lake that you are forced to listen to Howard Stern on a portable radio with half dead batteries. He isn't up there playing volleyball, pounding Budweiser's and barb-a-queuing, he's working.
George is a great manager. He knows when and to who to delegate responsibility to. I'd be more nervous if GW was directly controlling troop movements and personally selecting targets. Someone pointed out LBJ as a prime example of a commander in chief who couldn't delegate.
The towns in NoVa I referenced are true heavy hitters. You need to look at who is "head quartered" in these towns to understand (but you're far from stupid, so you probably already ).

 

Give it a rest.

You know as well as I do that if he had stayed, you'd have found something critical to say about that as well.... "he is so nervous about the outcome he can't even let his men do their jobs."

Ditto the comment about Johnson in Vietnam. Same/same Carter in the hostage rescue failure in Iran. Make the decison, give the launch order, then get the hell out of the way.

 

Last I heard, all of the main players that he needed to see face to face were at Camp David with him. Camp David is fully equipped for running the country as is Air Force One. He isn't sending any bad message to citizens in touch with reality.

 

"What really pisses me off is how we have these old farts "instrumanting" the war...while US is sending these brainwashed 18 and 19 year old kids out there to die...

Most of these kids don't even know WTF is going on."


Nahhh. That's not it at all.

What really pisses you off is that Bush didn't personally consult with you prior to making his decision... and that he has the office of President at all.

Actually, you last sentence was the most self-descriptive I've seen recently.

 

And furthermore, you got a lot of damn nerve with a comment like that... that the US troops are brainwashed and ignorant.

Those kids VOLUNTEER to serve their country, even as it takes them into harms way. That is something to be proud of. You sit back here and whine. They risk their lives... so you call them brainwashed and ignorant.

You know, even in WWII there were guys that wussed out. No one expects EVERYONE to agree with policy and strategy. But denigrating the troops that carry it out as you have is disgusting. Your comment says a lot more about you than it says about anything else.

 

Posted by Joss:

Actually, you last sentence was the most self-descriptive I've seen recently.

I'm not the one rallying for the war, hence I don't feel I have the responsibility to do anything about it. Not to mention I'm not a US citizen, therefore I can't serve. Feel stupid now.

Those kids VOLUNTEER to serve their country, even as it takes them into harms way. That is something to be proud of. You sit back here and whine. They risk their lives... so you call them brainwashed and ignorant.

Like you said, KIDS. The reason they are out there is most likely they don't know any better. Some of them don't even want to be out there. The US goverment doesn't think you're capable of handling drinking until you're 21...but is sending the same kids out there into deadly situations to die "for their country". Some of them with as little as 3 months training. The last time I checked the US is not under any immidate threat from Iraq nor any other country. Hypocrites.

btw:
Did I piss you off with the other post???
Thought so.

 

Please don't tell me what I would or wouldn't say. You are forgetting that I made the joke ahead of when Dumbya' left town. How would I be able to criticize him for staying if I made a joke about him leaving?

 

"How would I be able to criticize him for staying if I made a joke about him leaving?"

What requirement have you for logic or reality in your criticism? It seems Bush need only hold his office to receive it.

Hagasan,
One of the cheapest ways to excuse avoiding a responsibility is to say that those that met it are either brainwashed or ignorant. In any case, I suspect you have provided just about as much service to whatever country tolerates your citizenship... as you have to ours - zero.

Yes, like I said... kids. Kids have always been the soldiers. Always.

If that is a shock to you then you are badly ignorant. And no... you did not piss me off in the other post. You make me feel a little sad to see that someone could reach your age of about 23 and be so full of nothing... but so willing to share it. Thanks for asking though.

 

"How would I be able to criticize him for staying if I made a joke about him leaving?"

What requirement have you for logic or reality in your criticism? It seems Bush need only hold his office to receive it.

Right. Anyone who disagrees with you is illogical and disconnected with reality.

It can't possibly be that we just disagree. You're right and I'm illogical and out of touch with reality. Not to mention that I've got some personal ax to grind with Dubya'.

This debate is going nowhere.

 

Posted by Joss:

Hagasan, One of the cheapest ways to excuse avoiding a responsibility is to say that those that met it are either brainwashed or ignorant. In any case, I suspect you have provided just about as much service to whatever country tolerates your citizenship... as you have to ours - zero.

Yes, like I said... kids. Kids have always been the soldiers. Always.

If that is a shock to you then you are badly ignorant. And no... you did not piss me off in the other post. You make me feel a little sad to see that someone could reach your age of about 23 and be so full of nothing... but so willing to share it. Thanks for asking though.

Considering you're not out there either, your opinion holds no merit. The fact that kids have always been soilders, dosen't make it right nor acceptable. It just makes it sad, especially considering the fact it's accepted by an elder-statesman like yourself.

Hope you made yourself feel better by putting me down. Twice so far. I guess it just goes to show who's the kid here... I'm willing to learn. That's what life is about, but I'm not willing to have bullsh@t shoved down my throat by people like you. Just because you think it's right dosen't make it so. I'm willing to live with that fact. Are you?

What makes me sad is the fact that you let a 23 year old fart like me, get you worked up over something that is so obvious to "non-ingorant" people. Thanks for playing that game.

 

Sorry, fella. I didn't say YOU lack logic or reality. I just said that your criticism of Bush finds little basis in them.

 

Hagasan 1, Joss 0

 

"Considering you're not out there either, your opinion holds no merit."

Hagasan, I took my turn some years ago.

And, if my opinion meant nothing, you wouldn't be all upset about it, now would you.

 

Posted by Joss:

And, if my opinion meant nothing, you wouldn't be all upset about it, now would you

I'm not upset.
You're the one that went off on me.

Do me a favor....before responding, re-read your own posts.



Cheers, old man.