Bush's report card

Age? you are 3 years younger than I

Right wing? you aim, shoot and miss!

 

By "us" I take it you dont mean the 39% of americans who disagreed with sending troops. Which would be, what, just over 100,000,000 people?

I'm very grateful for a lot of things the USA has done. But I also realize that it has deliberately chose to take on that role politically and militarily since the end of WW2. Just because I support the US in general doesn't mean I will blindly approve of every move it makes.

None of the above is meant to be critical of the US troops in Iraq. I hope they are successful and democracy is established.

 

WHIFFF, WHIFFF, WHIFF
three strikes I'll head for the bench.
Okay old fart, give me a hint for my next at bat, your political positioning or ideology?

 

You’re a stinking Canadian aaayyy, my statement said nothing about supporting the troops, it only inferred that as a non-american citizen your perspective on “our” troops or what “we” agree on about them is irrelevant. They are NOT your troops, nor are “our” troops sent against their will.

And FYI on the 39% it is also irrelevant, as many as 39% of the Americans I meet are MORONS when it comes to the world and politics in general, they follow and expound the same moronic dribble I read here.

America is a DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC NOT A DEMOCRACY… our media and government schools brainwash our children and the mind numbed masses with the incorrect idea that we are a “majority rules democracy”.

 

i like this dude.

 

my statement said nothing about supporting the troops, it only inferred that as a non-american citizen your perspective on “our” troops or what “we” agree on about them is irrelevant. They are NOT your troops, nor are “our” troops sent against their will.

And where does this leave British and Australians who might comment on this little adventure?

 

This explains, BTW, why so many insist that Bush stole the election. They don't (or won't) understand the process. It is not election or governance by majority vote.

This is from some information I have stored on a disk, sorry I don't remember it's origin, believe it was from a US Government publication some years ago;

Democracy:

A government of the masses.
Authority derived through mass meeting or any other form of "direct" expression.
Results in mobocracy.
Attitude toward property is communistic--negating property rights.
Attitude toward law is that the will of the majority shall regulate,
whether is be based upon deliberation or governed by passion, prejudice, and impulse, without restraint or regard to consequences.
Results in demogogism, license, agitation, discontent, anarchy.


Republic:

Authority is derived through the election by the people of public
officials best fitted to represent them.
Attitude toward law is the administration of justice in accord with
fixed principles and established evidence, with a strict regard to
consequences.
A greater number of citizens and extent of territory may be brought within its compass.
Avoids the dangerous extreme of either tyranny or mobocracy.
Results in statesmanship, liberty, reason, justice, contentment, and progress.
Is the "standard form" of government throughout the world.


A republic is a form of government under a constitution which provides for the election of (1) an executive and (2) a legislative body, who working together in a representative capacity, have all the power of appointment, all power of legislation, all power to raise revenue and appropriate expenditures, and are required to create (3) a judiciary to pass upon the justice and legality of their government acts and to recognize (4) certain inherent individual rights.
Take away any one or more of those four elements and you are drifting into autocracy. Add one or more to those four elements and you are drifting into democracy

Superior to all others.--Autocracy declares the divine right of kings; its authority can not be questioned; its powers are arbitrarily or unjustly administered.
Democracy is the "direct" rule of the people and has been repeatedly tried without success.
Our Constitutional fathers, familiar with the strength and weakness of both autocracy and democracy, with fixed principles definitely in mind, defined a representative republican form of government. They "made a very marked distinction between a republic and a democracy * * * and said
repeatedly and emphatically that they had founded a republic."

 

It leaves them to discuss it with the officials of their own governments who agreed to commit troops to the effort. They are our allies, not our subjects. The US did not force them into the war.

 

so I guess it's up to the enlightened few around here to save us... might as well take away our vote cuz we're too stupid and brainwashed to use it corectly

 

Speak proudly for yourself, waste your vote or do with it what you please. Cast if for a cigar smoking skirt chasing sexual harassing draft dodging pardoned felon, it is your prerogative and I support your right to do it!

 

Well Said!

 

As long as "your" troops are anywhere outside "your" country, everybody has a legitimate right to give their opinion.

That's very arrogant but I won't call it moronic dribble. Lets make a list of countries where "39%" of their population are considered irrelevant. I'll start with Syria, Libya and Iraq.

Technically it's a federal republic but (while some democrats might disagree ), no president been elected and lost the popular vote, and only a few electors have gone against party lines, in the last century so I'm not sure what your point is.

As I've said before, I support the US, just not blindly. And you seem to be attacking people more than actually debating what's in the thread. Brad is a bad influence

 

it only inferred that as a non-american citizen your perspective on “our” troops or what “we” agree on about them is irrelevant

I would have thought that the perspective of "our" troops by a citizen of a country allied to the US in Iraq is very relevant.

As long as "your" troops are anywhere outside "your" country, everybody has a legitimate right to give their opinion.

Very true and this applies to any nation at any time.

 

My original statement pertained to and included the following quote. You have removed it from this context and then attempted to expand its relevance..

quote:

Originally posted by Papa Thiam

Don't misunderstand my position. Just because I think a bad decision was made does not mean I don't want American troops to come home safely,



I object to Papa’s statement, Our troops did choose to go! And the “We are standing together” attempts to co-opt the statement of American troops coming home safely, with a false statement “They did not choose to go”. This co-mingling of a position that no one could deny “Just because I think a bad decision was made does not mean I don't want American troops to come home safely” with the statement “. They did not choose to go there.” Tied up neatly with the all inclusive statement of “we are standing together.”

I will not be co-opted in this load of crap by a foreigner no less.

Papa used the proper term of “American troops” in what he said, but the additional statement is blatantly false, and "we do not stand together…"

With respect what the US does militarily in the world you are free to express any opinion you like

With respect to OUR troops, they are not YOURS and they have all volunteered for ANY mission they are sent on. Do not speak of them in the possessive of “our, we” etc,, they are not “YOURS”

AS for the 39% you defend, most in the world make it a point to rail against the US population for its ignorance of world issues and history, the facts are the facts.... It is humiliating to watch man on the street interviews in the US, please defend that 39%.. I do not advocate that they not vote nor be denied anything, it is their right to be ignorant….


As for Brad influence, think what ever you like....

 

For some reason I did not get the full statement by Papa in my last post,, here it is in the complete form...

 

Originally posted by Yamaha Fan


quote:

Originally posted by Papa Thiam

I don't want American troops to come home safely,
Don't misunderstand my position. Just because I think a bad decision was made does not mean I don't want American troops to come home safely. They did not choose to go there. On this, we are standing together.


I
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



For some reason I did not get the full statement by Papa in my last post,, here it is in the complete form...


I don't think he actually said that first line as a stand alone statement.

 

Your right, missed getting it all again..

"Don't misunderstand my position. Just because I think a bad decision was made does not mean I don't want American troops to come home safely. They did not choose to go there. On this, we are standing together."

There now that is what he said... (thanks)

 

Didn't want the 39% taking it as gospel

 

I've never heard of soldiers being allowed to choose where they are sent. And Papa said he was "standing together" with t316's opinion. t316 disagreed.

Anyway hopefully a compromise will be reached so some of those foreigners will help foot the bill, and send troops to Iraq.

 

Is that what I meant? I think we know better. What I inferred is that members of the United States military voluntarily make the choice to obey the orders of the Commander and Chief of the U.S. military forces. If he orders that the military go to Iraq, they go, because they chose to follow his orders. We have no draft, no compulsory military service, each man and woman who serves in the military serves voluntarily, with full knowledge that they might be called upon to make the ultimate sacrifice (that is lay down their life) in service to their country. I was proud to do it, and I know of many who felt and feel the same way. Maybe that's just plain corny or silly to more enlightnened, more wordly and wise people.

What Papa was standing together with me on was our fervent hope that all those serving in the military return home safely. I don't recall ever disagreeing with that. I don't believe I made any reference to soldiers choosing where they go prior to the post made by Papa that you are referring to.

Now that's my take, if you would like to question Papa on this, please, by all means.