Whats going on in Oregon?

False. The Second Amendment as now construed grants the individual right to bears. It does not give one the right to use them illegally, whether against the government or a person.

 

No violence, looting or burning so far.
I can see why they are labeled terrorists by the media.
And why BLM isn't. These rednecks need to start a riot if they want any sympathy.
Burn the CVS after looting it.

 

You mean that the government against which people would be fighting would consider that fighting illegal? Really?

 

Don't be an idiot. Orvis implied a Constitutional right that does not exist. I corrected him in what was probably his misstatement.

 

#rednecklivesmatter

 

I'm calling horseshit. These guys can't survive without some access to the products of modern civilization. These guys are still going to be reliant on trucks, ATVs, snowmobiles or whatever to get around so they can go hunt or forage. I doubt they're going to chop firewood all day to stay warm. It's good if they do, they will burn up more calories and use up their supply of food. This is not Lewis and Clark we're talking about. Without the vehicles they won't survive. All the government has to do is cut off their access to civilization and deny them use of their vehicles.

One other little fun fact. Once they don't report for prison when they should've, they become fugitives. Hello US Marshalls and additional prison time. This is nothing but a gambit to get out of serving their sentences. Why do you think they did it a day before they're supposed to show up for prison? It's so if the government goes in to take them, they look heavy handed. This is a negotiating tactic to get a reduced sentence.

As for the arson, the government alleges they were doing it to cover up poaching. That may or may not be true, but if it is it explains the reason they were so intensely prosecuted.

 

I have no idea what is being left out of this version of the events, but it makes for some interesting reading on the back story here.

http://theconservativetreehouse.com...uge-in-protest-to-hammond-family-persecution/

 

They should be punished, but I'm sure the whole story is more nuanced than that. Maybe the BLM was allowing Federal land adjacent to their land become overgrown and become a fire hazard and they decided to do something about it after years of complaining. Seems plausible to me. From what I understand it was a controlled burn. The government says they were poaching and burned down the land to cover it up. That also sounds plausible. Who the hell knows the actual truth? Fact is, they did violate Federal law and a well functioning society needs to enforce the law. Blatantly breaking Federal laws and giving them the finger is just plain moronic. The wheels of justice turn slowly, but grind exceedingly fine. Look at what they did to Ross Ulbricht AKA the founder of Silk Road.

 

Gee, that never happens elsewhere with the government turning a blind eye. Selective enforcement.

 

I don't think anyone is saying they shouldn't, as they were originally sentenced. Now the new judge has deemed them "Eco-Terrorists" and added time.

 

The founders of our Constitution made it abundantly clear why the second Amendment was put into place. The Federalist papers discussed it at length. It was for the defense of themselves against many things including a tyrannical Government. Obviously, if firearms are used against a tyrannical Government, according to the Government, it's against the law.


http://www.thefederalistpapers.org/history/the-founding-fathers-on-the-second-amendment

 

That's one of my missing hashtags.

 

OK, disregard my last post to you. I understand what you're saying. You are in fact, correct in that the Constitution does not give us the right to raise arms against the Government. Indirectly, the Second Amendment does however, give us the means to do so when, and if, needed.

 

It seems like the government had it out for these people and they gave them the ammunition necessary to fuck them over. We'll probably never know the real story. I'd guess the government is fucking them over pretty hard. If this gambit works, good for them. However, I don't see how they can win unless total morons are in charge of clearing them out. When they lose they're only going to get fucked even more. I'm seeing their 5 year sentences becoming 20+.

 

Incidentally, burning off the grass was, and still is, one of the best methods of refreshing the growth of most prairie grasses. It usually occurs when lightening does it naturally but when man does it it's supposed to be bad. Pisses off Smoky ya know.

 

You do know that they denounced the entire protest and showed up for prison right>??? I am not understanding why they would get more time than has already been tacked on..
The son already did a year and Pops I think 4 months (he is 75 so an additional 4-5yrs he may not see the outside alive).

 

I'm more perturbed by the selective application of laws than by this particular situation. If you are not going to enforce a law, remove it from the books. I don't see citizen ranchers as any more in your face than border jumpers, but guess who gets the boot on the neck.

 

well, if a man has an identity crisis and thinks he is an "individual" or "citizen" or whatever legal fiction a law merchant guild create then you might be correct but I dont think man was created by such a guild and need not rely it or a "G.D. piece of paper" for any rights.

All Rights Reserved

 

"In the early fall of 2001, Steven Hammond (Son) called the fire department, informing them that he was going to be performing a routine prescribed burn on their ranch. Later that day he started a prescribed fire on their private property. The fire went onto public land and burned 127 acres of grass. The Hammonds put the fire out themselves."

I'm trying to figure out how many years you think these ranchers should spend in PRISON for setting fire to THEIR land before it caught fire to YOUR land?
Are ya kidding me Mongo? Wildfires are a huge problem? I tell ya what's a huge problem, and that's peoples land being stolen so it can become YOUR land. Sitting in an 8X8 for 5 yrs is a huge problem.

You wanna know why ranchers here in Texas have to pay people to kill beavers on their land? If the beaver builds a dam and the water backs up enough the feds are known for coming in and declaring the land "Wetlands" which means guess what.....you can't hunt on it, fish on it, or do anything on it. But guess what you do have to do.....keep paying taxes on it. The BLM has a land grab problem.

A lot of people in this country have no idea this is happening, and that's cool. But saying that a 70 yr old couple are bitches that need to be smacked down? Look at the picture of the Hammonds couple, do they look like terrorists to you?