Time run out for Herrin?

Exactly. So what do you think would be more effective at this point? Continue doing what they've been doing, or trying some of the things he is asking for even if they know it's wrong? What do they have to lose? And what if it helps him psychologically and results start improving?

Yes.

I know for a fact that it is extremely dissatisfied with his season.

I do not buy the anti-American conspiracy theory for a second.

 

If you are willing to dig up some older interviews, Hayes had a few comments on this and most were sort of "read between the lines" but I got the impression most if not all the set up was done at the work direction of Hayes and his side of the team then this info was made open and directly shared etc.

 

Yeah, Hayes/Graves had already went through the rough times back in 2009/2010. By the time Herrin (and Boobie) got there, the bike was sorted.

 

Regardless of how it turns out, Herrin will be a better rider because of this year. I have to feel like when he gets back on a bike he is comfortable with (AMA/BSB, whereever) he will be a better rider after this experience. Especially if he gets back to tracks he is comfortable with.

I have a feeling if he comes back to the AMA, on a bike he knows, on tracks he knows, with a chip on his shoulder and people to prove wrong...he will be hell on wheels.

 

Top 10 is actually pretty respectable.

 

Gawd, I hope he doesn't come back here. Right now, there isn't even anything to come back to other than WERA pro.

Stay over there. Ride WSS or whatever you can get.

Haslam didn't set the world on fire his first try over there. Well, he's not setting it on fire the last two either but he was for a few years and he was the next Sheene.

 

Could this be a Blake Young kind of free fall? That was my first thought atleast.

 

It's my understanding that the track at mid Ohio has deteriorated quite a bit in that time. Still, Mladin and Spies would kick Herrin's but on a superbike, just like Hayes did in most races.

 

...but I hope Josh gets at least another year on the world stage to establish himself.

 

I agree. Hayes has proven to be a world class rider.

 

Define compete.

Not saying anything new here. There is a reason why certain riders obtain or are on better equipment then other riders during their respective careers. On a whole the more talented riders will ultimately gravitate toward the better teams and equipment. All three riders were in the same series together for multiple years.

Looking at each riders entire piece of work, I think a pretty accurate conclusion can be drawn with regards to at what level they would compete against each other. But for sure all three are incredible racers.

 

Its an opinion. Not a statement of fact. I've seen enough from Hayes on the world stage to make the statement I did. The few times he's been given a chance, (moto gp, wss) he's done really well. He's a better rider than Herrin.

What's ridiculous is the way that you can't see the truth about a few riders you're friends with.

 

There were no spec tires in 2008. There were, however, magic tires.

 

I was speaking of your general delusions when it comes to Herrin and Spies, that you have demonstrated over the course many posts.

For some reason, you have a problem with me posting my opinion, which is based on great wildcard rides Hayes has done, as well as his battles with Mladin in Matt's last year.

The post I made can be reasonably inferred from J. Hayes' past wildcard rides where he was well into the points of both Moto GP and WSS, on one off rides. He got on bikes and tires that he was unfamiliar with, and got up to speed very quickly. There's no reason for an unbiased person to think that he wouldn't do the same on the Caterham bike.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hate McDead View Post
<Really long paragraph with no breaks> So even if the team has failed to try to develop the bike to fit his riding style, neither has the rider developed his skills to work with the bike. Really, so far, it's been a big disappointment for everyone all the way around concerning Herrin. Nothing good has come out of this so far and the season is winding down fast...

Exactly. So what do you think would be more effective at this point? Continue doing what they've been doing, or trying some of the things he is asking for even if they know it's wrong? What do they have to lose? And what if it helps him psychologically and results start improving?

Assuming that the scuttlebutt is true and that there is a rift with the team and the rider about set up, then something needs to be done. I find it hard to believe that Catherham is so intractable that they won't accept input from the rider, but if this is true than it seems reasonable that (just for fuck's sake) nothing has worked so far so let's let the rider hang himself with his suggestions. And, if by some miracle, the rider's suggestions start working (by design or default or just because Herrin's head is appeased) then "helleluyah". In the end, I betting on more of the same results though no matter what happens.
Ultimately this issue that's being covertly aired out about the team's lack of regard for Herrin has been played out again and again over the decades in motorsports. The list is a revolving door of excuses. The team won't listen to the suggested changes, the other rider/driver is getting better support, the other rider/driver is getting better parts. The implication is that 'if only' this or that was done that Herrin would get better results and that the fault is not his but the team's lack of support. This is an old saw that's been rehashed again and again. It's probably a good position to take for the rider when it comes to finding a new team as the blame is being passed along.

Really though, I just don't think Herrin's got the right stuff for this class yet. Give him all the credit in the world for jumping into the deep end of the pool. But who is going to bankroll him while he gets another year or two under his belt to learn the tracks and the system? I'm thinking 'one and done'. Which is not to say that his career is over. On the contrary, he just might make another stab at it overseas and be successful. I wouldn't put a lot of stock in that direction though.
And here in the US... There are better riders in the Yamaha program than Herrin right now. I don't see him returning to glory here since the options are so meager. And truth be told, Hayes handed Herrin the championship by his many mistakes that season as well as a few ill timed mechanicals. But the history books are written and Herrin would be sporting the #1 plate at New Jersey this month.... no arguing that.
And thanks to the grammar Nazis for pointing out my dribble needs to be paragraphed better!

 

I love people sitting on the outside of the ropes know whats going on with J.H.

I just wish he would come on here and challenge all the haters to a race,Then see whos got room to talk.

 

ahem Drivel