Machinists, learn me a bit

Chris, check this local auction house out.

http://murphyauction.com/

They frequently have Machine Shop Auctions.

 

Wheel spacers. Wheel balancing cones. Wheel bearing press discs.


Wheels.

 

I told my wife: “anything I want that’s round and under 9” !”

 

I paid for a G code class at my local Haas factory outlet last year around this time. The other people in the class were sent by their company. The 2 guys sitting behind me never machined ever and their boss wanted them to learn how to run a VF5 with 50 taper to profile rock! All I could think of was that poor machine, they must have destroyed that thing by now.
The guy sitting next to me that was a FT machinist was commenting how he still trigs out bolt holes and other angles manually, with today's software why would anyone bother plus think of the time wasted

For less complex parts I usually set my Z high and run the program in the air before giving it a go, single block and 25% rapid with my hand on feedhold as I approach the part.
Always run
T1 M06
G90 G54 G00 X0. Y0.
G43 H01 Z4.
before doing anything just to double check things, keep a 6" scale on the machine for measuring the 4"

 

Ah . . . ok? Metal head? Is that you?

 

Do you any of you CNC guys have any idea what these Hurcos might be worth?
All this talk has rekindled my interest in going CNC at some point.
https://cleveland.craigslist.org/tls/d/cleveland-hurco-cnc-mills-more/6799139035.html

 

No idea what they're worth, but they look well optioned , and I've read good things about those Hurcos for 3d surfacing but have never seen one in the flesh. I think they'd be similar to Haas in resale value, so that might help with comparables.

 

Just went and drooled over this - https://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/tld/d/auburn-jet-13x40-belt-drive-lathe-stand/6823388911.html

It's from a reputable shop that's the area's largest Jet dealer, so I trust that it's in as-new condition. It doesn't come with any cutters, just a three-jaw, four-jaw and faceplate. Spindle bore is a hair under 1-1/2".

Looks like it retails new for $6,800... feels like a pretty good deal. Am I just honeymooning from going and seeing it? Or should I jump on this?

 

I was going to ask that very question a few days ago and forgot, the above answer is essentially all I'd ever want one for.

A few yrs ago, I needed an aluminum offset washer made for a fender strap on my KTM and couldn't use it until I came up with one (I had lost one). So I showed a riding buddy who has a mill similar to the one Chris just posted above. A week later he told me to come pick it up and it was like I bought it from the store, which wasn't an option since they stopped making this particular strap.

Ever since, I dreamt of buying one of those benchtop mills for exactly this sort of stuff, smallish things, really no bigger than wheel spacers, etc.......any recommendations???

 

I would not. 1 3/8 bore is to small for that size machine. They also charging you tax so you are over $4k.
Another $1k would get you same as my 14x40 and comes with DRO, quick change tool post and 2" bore.
Or for same money you get 12x36 with 1 9/16 bore and brand new instead used.

 

I'd pass on that one also at that price. Spindle bore is a bit small at 1.375" but the longer bed and steady make stem work possible. No quick change toolpost either, although a 4 way isn't THAT bad I guess....Plus there's zero tooling with it, so you're in to buying toolbits, boring bars etc. It all adds up.....

Something better suited to what you need will come along

 

Awesome, thanks guys. Will pass on it.

What are your thoughts on square-column mill/drills vs full-on knee mills? I know the knee mills are better, and I've also read enough to know that mill/drills have gotten a pretty bad rep - but it seems like most of the distaste for them is due to the disadvantages of round-column units. As far as I can tell, a square-column mill/drill is actually pretty good but just can't take as heavy a cut as a knee mill can. Now that I'm getting more comfortable with what I should be looking for in a lathe, I'm starting the learning about mills.

 

If you want to make spacers, you probably want a lathe instead of a mill, and that's been basically the exact topic of the last seven pages, if I'm understanding correctly

Check out This Old Tony's "Minilathe" video (it's not... technically.. a YT link!). For wheel-spacer-size things, something that size would do fine.

 

https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/tls/d/portland-shop-fox-m1020-lathe/6810688230.html
Better deal than that Jet for same money. Bigger, DRO, quick change, 2 piece jaws...etc.
Little high price but you can negotiate

 

You can make perfectly good wheel spacers on a mill. It's just a different approach. Easier on the lathe from a work holding and efficiency stand point but can be done on the mill. If you are into making mostly round items then the Lathe should be your first choice. Having said that with a good 4 jaw chuck and some creativity you can make square shit on the lathe as well. Thousands of ways to skin the same cat.

The problem you face on the mill doing work like that is you run can run out of space very quickly. A boring head with even a short bar sticking out of it eats up 5 inches of travel before you ever put any work holding and material under it. On the smaller mills that space gets very limiting very quickly. Yeah you can do a circular interpolation with an end mill but it will almost certainly not be perfectly round when done. I always use my boring head if something needs to be perfectly round.

 

Start with a lathe, the learning curve is easier. You're going to end up with a lathe, a mill, a band saw at a minimum anyway.
The square column mills are fine and can accomplish high quality work depending on the skill of the operator and working within their limits. The best machines are always bigger and heavier.
The same concepts apply IMO. If you're going with a square column type mill get the real deal Rong Fu RF45, made in Taiwan, not the Chinese knock offs. It's a bit more expensive but higher quality.

 

Both of these popped up recently:

https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/tls/d/portland-rutland-metal-lathe/6847170470.html

https://wenatchee.craigslist.org/tls/d/entiat-lathe-clausine/6851653953.html

There's also this barely-post-WWII Atlas 12": https://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/tls/d/marysville-1946-atlas-12x36-and-10x54/6842647313.html

I'm guessing that the Clausing is the "best", but the Rutland looks like it's pretty good too though if I ever want parts I'll have to scrounge among all the various Taiwanese imports. I'm going down to Portland this weekend actually so will probably go check that one out then.

 

The Clausing has collets and has the 'Hardinge-style) Royal-Collet adapter mounted on the headstock, I dont see the Collet-Arm-assy, but it shuld be there somewhere.
I dont know which one to get, but I can tell you the collet adapter makes life worth living.

Edit: Says he has the metric gears too, I think thats like $1K when you can find them

 

The Rutland has a US & Metric gearbox. Not sure of the machine/quality, but I believe metric threads were important to you.

 

Yep, I noticed that too It also seems like the more modern import models have larger bores than the older US models, though I can't find specs for either. I did find a reference on some forum to the metric adapter for the Clausing being big $$$$ so yeah that might be the answer right off the bat.