What are your launch procedures for a good start?

what is your definition of "hard"?
what kinda 60' times are you running?

 

Your entire last season? Mid pack finishes that I saw were 3 plus seconds behind the guy in front. That has nothing to do with a start that gets you or the other guy into T1 first. 3 seconds is you running slightly slower each lap than the guy in front of you.

No disrespect here, but Chaotic is a fairly well accomplished racer and I think he probably has just a tad more race experience...

My opinion to the OP is that you need to do this like anything else relating to racing - practice. Go to the strip, ask for cones to be placed at the race practices, go to a parking lot, etc. You need to keep at it. Watch the top guys. Look at body position, listen to the revs, watch the way they launch, etc. This whole holding the brake, revving to the limiter, etc is all weird and pretty much unique. If it works for those guys? Great. Maybe it will work for you...

But, just like riding position and riding style, it is all very much based on the rider and what they prefer and what is comfortable for them. I have watched guys do some weird shit when starting and they always get a great start. I've tried it and it gets me worse results than my typical shit start. My way seems to work sometimes and I certainly won't give you advice as it is like the saying "Opinions are like..."

My issue is that I suck at starts. Always have and probably won't change. Once in a GREAT while, I get a decent start, but just like this last year, I only got one good start in all the classes I ran and it was the race I got beat in... So, getting to T1 first isn't always going to net the best results. It can't hurt for sure, but just remember one thing - it is sometimes MUCH easier to sit in second than it is to lead...

 

Every bike is different, so what works on 1 bike might not work on another. And like you said, everyone has a little different style, just like BP.

Some people will constantly "blip" the throttle with the RPM's varying the whole time; some will get to a constant throttle and maintain it; some will launch with 2 feet on the ground; some will launch with 1 foot on the ground; some will be WAY over the tank/windscreen and some (like Josh Hayes) will be sitting up a lil more and looking more relaxed.

Like he said, just figure out what works for you.

 

You're right, the guy that was winning all of them got away from all of us. It was me and the guy that came in second that I had troubles with. Beating him was a race win in my mind.

Either way, its impressive that you took the time to look up my race results just to jump on another opportunity to argue with me in a public forum. No disrespect you say? Whatever, you wouldn't pass up a chance.

You truly are a douche bag of immense proportions.

 

I'll go ahead and do some talking here since you've decided to show true colors and use the name calling... And to think you've told me on numerous occasions that you are this Billy Badass business guy that has lead your company to great things and act as if that all means something out here...

One, you talk as if you have race experience. You don't. Racing 2-3 rounds with FT doesn't make you a seasoned veteran. You sling around your WERA race number and yet you have what, 2 races in 4 years of riding? Seriously.

Two, my comment was that in those minimal local club races you have done, you have finished about 3+ seconds on avrage behind the guy in front of you. Your comment (which you now back pedal and say the guy that won ran away when you only finished 3rd in 2 of your 8 races...) doesn't add up. That little difference at the start isn't going to make up for an average of 3 seconds behind the guy that placed in front of you - let alone the leader...

The deal is that you argue with guys that have decent race results, have MUCH more seat time and certainly more skill. You come across as an arrogant dude that acts as if he's fast enough to be talking like he knows it all. You don't. I've watched you ride, I have seen your abilities and I have heard the crap spew out of your mouth to riders wanting to learn more. I've tried to talk to people that do know you and they've told me that you are a tough guy to read. I've tried. It ain't happening.

You and I will never see eye to eye, but I will also not let you come on here and argue points with a guy like Chaotic that runs a legit program and has earned the right to educate other riders. Chaotic is also a coach with STT in the south and trust me when I say - there's a reason you aren't coaching anymore... That's been my issue with you for a long time. You really need to read and not speak. Know what i mean?

Get off your pride for a minute, maybe go over to the MotoSeries site and jibber jabber on that forum and leave the WERA forum for the big kids. MMMMKAY?

By the way, you wanna do name calling? Try it via PM. Much easier on yourself that way.

 

Wellll.... Back on topic anyway...

A few things I believe are key to a good launch: Whatever rpm you decide on make sure that it's constant as you wait for the flag to drop. Blipping the throttle means that you have a 50/50 chance of being off the gas when the flag drops, which destroys your reaction time.
The other thing I don't do, is wait to see green before I react. The starter will usually have the flag behind him as he prepares to start the race. I make sure that I can see his elbow, and when I see his elbow move, I go. If you wait to see green, you've already lost the race to the first turn.
It also helps to watch the starter for a few races before yours so that you can see any habits he might have that can give you a clue about timing.

 

Are riders penalized for "false starts"? For example, if a rider misreads the starter dropping the flag.

 

That would be called a "meatball" flag. And yes you CAN be penalized....if they catch you

 

Brian, I honestly think you might actually be insane. I don't know what reality you are living but for fuck's sake dude, take some meds.

I will continue to share my experiences with others as I see fit. You can continue to show YOUR true colors by showing up in every single thread that I post and act like the fuck-knuckle that you are by arguing with ME every time I share my experiences/advice with someone. You provoke this shit with me every time. Never once have I ever called you out or questioned/ridiculed your advice or credibility. For example, I could ask when was the last time you raced a whole season, wasn't it like 6 years ago? But I'm not going to do that, because it's disrespectful. You are entitled to your opinion. My 10 year old step-son is more mature than you are, and I would never allow him to behave the way you do.

Nowhere and at no time have I ever claimed to be god's gift to racing. You think that anyone that hasn't been racing for 10 years doesn't have an opinion that's worth more than yours. If you don't agree with I've got to say, fine, I really don't give two squirts of piss at this point. But it's really comical though that you act like such a child and can't just move along in disagreement, you have to start this same .... exact.... shit on every single forum.

I have no disagreement with Chaotic at all, I'm not even arguing with him, I'm just sharing my opinion on the matter. Why is it that you have to think that if someone expresses an opposing opinion that its cause for a disagreement? I respect Chaotic's opinion and the OP should consider it as well. It's an open forum, all opinions are welcome. And I will continue to share mine, and you will continue to... well, be a douche bag.

Lastly, I'm glad the OP started this post, because as I said earlier starts are something I struggle with as well. I appreciate the feedback (not Lizard's) that's been provided here and will certainly use some of these tips (including Chaotic's) this season myself.

 

First of all, hopefully your 10 year old doesn't get as bent over the internet and pop a blood vessel and show HIS true colors by shouting out with the name calling like a 13 year old girl who got dumped right before the big dance.

Oh, and it has been roughly 4 years since I ran a full series. And, since you decided to go that route, if you EVER want to show the kids how it is done, I can provide them some on board of you seemingly going backwards in front of this washed up and old man... I also am willing to bet that every time the old, washed up guy shakes the cobwebs off, he doesn't do too awfully bad. But, maybe you can show me around at the next track day. I'll slow down enough for ya.

I do it towards you because you DO act like you know what you are talking about. Your sig, the way you tell people about your "racing"... Dude, you are a rich guy that is capable of paying his way into this sport. You haven't raced a legit series, you haven't won anything and you certainly aren't at the skill level to be handing out suggestions and comments concerning racing. There are a SHIT pile of racers on here with less than 10 years experience and yet, they know more because they have accomplished more. It has nothing to do with years as much as it has to do with experience. Jake Lewis for example... I think he can give suggestions as opposed to a guy like yourself. And, I love how you think that I act like I should be heard. I only stated that it was all about practicing, all about how each rider does things differently. If you re-read (I know you are smart enough to comprehend) what I stated, I NEVER once nor do I EVER say "What I do" or state anything that says this is how to do it. Not once. But, your rage seems to cloud that and you tend to think it is easier to back pedal and to belittle to try and derail what we are discussing... Keep drinking the Haterrade...

I do it because one, I don't like you. Two, I think you are a joke - especially ever since you thought you should help people in this sport. Thirdly, you are wrong. But, you're not wrong because you are stupid. You are wrong because you have very little seat time and experience. Otherwise, you would agree with what guys like Chaotic and even myself have stated. But, continue telling everyone how you battle for the lead and would win if it were for a better start.

Let's see, did you agree with the fact that you need to just do more practicing? Maybe the fact that as stated, that you need more experience? I mean, you might be able to win a championship if you figure out the key to the holeshot, right? Rather, I am willing to bet that you could win a championship if you actually worked at it and rode more, got more seat time, more experience and oh yeah, maybe kept quiet instead of commenting.

 

Usually, anytime you move in WERA, you will get penalized for a false start essentially. In AMA, you have to keep the front tire in a small box. You can actually roll slightly as long as it doesn't go out of the box...

It's tough and honestly, it is a ton about reaction time, also. I've been on a 40 plus rider grid before at the GNF in front of everyone and thought I was in the second wave... We weren't in two waves...

All I know, I was thankful for a red flag to do it right the second time. Got lots of ribbing for that one...

 

Let the bike cool off between starts. Doing 15 in a row the clutch is going to fry for sure due to the heat. I did 65 race startes this season, was 1st in to T1 about 60 times. The clutch lasted about 50-55 starts and races.

 

wow, awesome thread for newbie racer. SO MUCH TO LEARN!

 

Back on topic here LOL: Find a dragstrip near you. Most places have one near them. Out here in Texas they have bike nights and every test and tune there are bikes there drag racing. Watch a few and see how they are doing it. DO NOT copy MotoGP they have launch control your clutch and throttle is your launch control. Blipping the throttle is never used in drag racing, why would you do it for a race start. Basically the same concept, you are trying to get to a spot the fastest, 1/8 mile, 1/4 mile, turn 1 all the same principles.

When I first got my bike I had an 03 Cobra with 585 to the wheel, I use to drag race it alot so I said lets drag the bike. Every bike has a RPM that will allow you to take off feather the clutch and get off the line, high enough to not bog the engine and low enough to not put as much stress on the clutch. On my 929 this was 6500rpm. You need to find this RPM for your bike, the drag strip will help. Find the launch RPM hold it there, let the clutch out to where it just starts to grab. I place my left foot on the shifter and right foot on the ground. When the light/flag whatever is used goes off or on then let the clutch out in a constant even release while at the same time twisting the throttle. You need to get this action down. Let off the clutch to much to soon you wheelie, twist the throttle to slow and you bog the engine down. But the letting the clutch out is not a slow thing, I mean let it out even but quick.

I started out at 7.9 in the 1/8th and by my 4th trip down the track I was running 6.9 on the 929. On my 1000 I was running 6.3. I know I could go faster but I was not doing burn outs and I was worried about the clutch.

Always remember there is no 1 way to do anything, something I might do might not work for crap with you. Best advice is try alot of different things you have read and then find something from each that suits you and build from there.

 

I believe that if you are asking this question, you are at a point in your racing where just making sure you get a safe start is what is important. By the time you are fast enough that getting a great launch will make a difference, you won't be asking this question here.

Ken

 

I like to hold the throttle steady at about 50% or 6k or so on my liter bike.

As I start to release the clutch I add as much throttle as I can without to much wheelie. Then with the throttle open continue to use the clutch to control RPM.

Its a fine line. One that can be practices at the strip on so then at the track.

Here is a sample...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fN1TDR7ihPw

Now I am an old geezer.... and don't get it right to often... so don't flame to hard...

 

That is what I have been trying to say all along.

 

Max Macallister had a really good video many years ago. IIRC It showed how to set up the clutch, 2mm of freeplay on the lever(cable) right foot on the ground with your leg behind the rearset, left foot ready to shift into second gear, eyes forward, throttle set to 70% (not blipping it like a 2 stroke) green flag drops! releasing the clutch lever smoothly out and as soon as it is out completely you should be ready for 2nd gear. Do not wheelie! You can't control a bike on one wheel.

 

I thought I'd bring this thread TTT, racing next year and I have no idea how to do a proper hole shot. Also the OP won't be riding for a while... Sorry Rob.

 

I shall return . . . one day



Let me know when & where. Although I have an idea.