Union mentality... I'll never understand it

I was a union commercial carpenter for 10 years before going out on my own and I can say the company I worked for did not put up with slugs, you work or your conveniently laid off. Now go down to McCormmick Place and that's another story people see the crap that goes on down there and think all the unions are like that. The unions make it way too hard for a small guy like me to go union so I can't do it. They are definitely on their way out I believe their benefit package now is unreal.

 

I literally see both sides every day.

Lockheed....I'm a salaried engineer.

Our CEO made 25 MILLION dollars last year.....the union in Fort Worth went on strike for numerous weeks earlier this year, in an attempt to keep pensions in place.

Did they succeed?....no....do I agree with that?....no.

Being honest, I might, if the execs didnt make 25 mil.

They did away with salaried pensions years back, but I'm grandfathered in.....the only way they out us of pension's is to lay us off, then re-hire us.....layoffs are coming....basically I would no longer accrue.....zero pension for new hires and rehires.

Healthcare costs are hard to fight....but pension elimination and 25 mil salaries I see as pure greed.

 

I understand that Mr overpaid CEO's benefit package doesn't have anything to do with the companies actual performance. That is THE problem. No publicly traded companies CEO is worth millions of dollars. They like to think they are but what did they actually do to earn that amount of money. The issue I still see is this "union vs. non-union" middle class fight. This thought that I make X amount and I have a better education and I work harder than the union guy who makes the same X amount is precisely what the wealthy want. Focus on the pennies while we steal the dollars.

Again I am not a fan of laziness, but people often find the minority story to illustrate why they hate unions. I'm willing to bet that there are as many, if not more, stories of wealthy greed and excess. We just don't get to hear them as often. When we do though it's amazing. BTW many of the benefits non-union employees take for granted were earned by unions. Just saying. We should be fighting corporate greed and not each other.

- Joe

FYI I'm not union, never have been and never will be. They would've held me back from progressing as I have. If I were a CEO I would rather shut the doors than have a union, but in my case, I would like to think that my employees wouldn't require or see a need for one as I'd be fair.

 

Another thing that seems to come into play, but really can't be quantified, is the "us vs them" mentality that seems be prevalent in union shops. It's almost as if they do things just to cause problems (both sides).

I don't like that. I don't want to work somewhere that I don't like, and I don't want to work for someone that doesn't like me. It should be a win/win situation, not a lose/lose.

 

I have had a first hand case of union sabotage twice this year. I go to a company to commission and optimize a new system and someone doesn't like seeing me disconnecting wires on my system to test fault functions. I come back later in the day to find everything faulted and find that someone has pulled jumpers and fuses out of the plc panel. Bunch of fucking babies, they couldn't do this work if I did leave it for them yet they get mad when I do it.

 

Same here. I was a union carpenter back in the 80's. I've worked in the office for union contractors since then and if within 2 hours of hiring, if a guy doesn't pan out you cut him a 2 hour check and send him on his way. Call the hall and get another.

But this seldom happens because the union here doesn't put up with guys that are let go multiple times.

 

I've been a union dredgemen for 11 years there won't be any scab dredges rebuilding any of those beaches. Acoe only contracts union dredges. Disaster or not.

 

You would consider people who would come to help get your area restored faster after something like this "scabs"? Congratulations on being part of the problem...

 

Who wins when somebody gets paid for NOT working?

 

I feel your pain!! Fellow Controls Engineer here. Stay the hell out of my panel!!

 

I didn't see it in the news story, but what project/task where they there for? Just assessing the damage and who's needed to do what will take days.

I can't see PSE&G or any utility company letting an outsider (union or not) take over any of the work. Just too much responsibility on their part. Getting power to the customers is one thing, but if their work causes a fire two weeks later, the law suits will fly.

But private buildings/projects? Can't see how anyone would be turned away.

 

Just for fun, a Quiz:

1. What's the largest unionized workforce in the US?

2. In that union, how are the union officers (chapter presidents, secretary, stewards) salaries funded?

 

There weren't any CMP (my local utility) crews responsible for restoring power in my neck of the woods. I don't recall the label on the sides of the trucks when they caravanned out of here Wed night, but I know they weren't from New England.

Maine declared a limited state of emergency expressly to allow CMP and Bangor Hydro to bring in outside crews. Happens with any big power event up here.

 

government - your tax dollars





what do I win?

 

more. enjoy.

 

Also, it may be linked to the Prevailing Wage Laws many states have for work performed for the state.

Many non-union companies do not pay the prevailing wage to their workers, and companies who refuse to pay the prevailing wage to their workers are ineligible to work on state contracts.

Anyone reporting on this in any informed way? I haven't seen it yet.

 

I don't agree with it that is just how it is.

 

The picture of the executive you paint is probably only applicable to a very small number of people.
At what income level does your putting food on the table sanctimony turn into their greed?


On another note, I think the argument has become muddied. The original workers discussed were essentially public employees, not the same as private companies, so the issues are different. There is no need for profit in the public sector so the excesses seem to reach ludicrous heights when it comes to public sector employees. You employ them, you pay them, but you can't fire them.

 

Fair enough. It is just that my opinion of the people that perpetuate things like that are slightly lower than whale shit. The rest of my opinion belongs on the Dungeon thread so I will stop now.

 

I can explain it very simply. It takes a basic understanding of the relationship between labor forces, the foundation of corporate structure and......oh, wait. coffee break. Gotta take my 20.