Question for the Police officers or lawyers.

I agree, as they should, it is after all their job, however the way in which the get involved can go many ways (and rightfully so). I have no problem with officers answering to public (or their own) concern. That being said, it seems that all to often now those interactions are becoming more robotic and militaristic in nature. That's just my thoughts from the outside looking in though.

Still, I hold firm in my beliefs that the good cops far outweigh the bad ones, yet the news/stories about good cops don't generate public interest. Unfortunately.

 

How about the ones in FL that shot an unarmed man in his driveway, according to them because he did not comply.

Florida deputies shoot man they mistook for car thief in his own driveway

 

I stopped watching at about 6:30.

The cops were being appropriately cautious in disarming the dad. They're allowed to disarm people they're dealing with, even when the armed person isn't committing a crime. They don't have to let the armed person do the disarming, either. The cops did way too much talking, though. They should have given the dad lawful orders and, the moment the dad didn't comply with one of those orders, they should have arrested him, informed him of the charge and been done with it. Cops don't have to talk to you any more than you have to talk to them and they don't have to do what you want them to do. The dad was an idiot and probably deserved to go to the best place for idiots.....jail.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/26/us/gun-robber-armed-with-bat/?iref=obinsite

 

I'd like to consider myself very pro 2nd amendment and think I've proven so in here over the years, HOWEVER, the person in the OP's link and everyone like him, I think, are causing unnecessary strife on an already hot topic/subject.

I feel, any person who thinks they can open carry ANY long gun, in public, in areas where it is deemed unusual are either misinformed and/or attention whores.

Personally, I completely disagree with the whole concept that someone open carrying a weapon cannot be questioned by LE or have to provide their information. I also think it's a very dangerous line they are setting by pushing that point. Hell, if they succeeded on that point every thug would be best suited to open carry cuz the second a LEO asks for ID they can just tell them to GFY......is that REALLY where we want it to go folks?

What's it going to take for someone like the subject in the OP's link to agree and think OK, maybe it is unreasonable to think I don't have to provide LE with an explanation and/or personal information???

As for his remark at the 9:36 mark, he's flat out wrong and being that it only happened about 3 yrs ago, you'd think a gun loving person would have been familiar with the incident. FOr those who have no clue what I'm talking about, youtube 'West Memphis shooting incident'......Hell, some of you cop loving folk might actually get some wood over it.

Here, I did the hard work for ya.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73hDVrI0fPw

 

I don't think anyone is saying that the cops have to do what you want them to do, but that they have to act within the law themselves.
And, just because a cop gives you an order, that doesn't mean he is giving you a lawful order.
A badge doesn't give you the right to tell anybody to do anything you want them to do, you have to have specific, lawful cause to give them those orders, and to force compliance with an order you have no legal right to give makes you the criminal.
I've heard many times that, if a cop gives you an order, you must comply, and it isn't that simple. Simply wearing a badge doesn't put you in charge of everyone in anyplace you happen to be.
If the situation and events were as described, and the officer just grabbed the guys weapon because "he felt threatened" just because the man had a weapon, how would that be different from a citizen suddenly grabbing a cop's handgun from his holster because "he felt threatened"?
One has just as much right to possess the gun as the other, and both have the right and expectation that someone else will not attempt to disarm them by force with no provocation. Merely standing there with a weapon is not provocation.

 

That video has nothing to do with the video the OP posted.
I don't think anyone here has had a problem with a cop checking on the situation, but the way in which it was done and the results.
The cop in the second video didn't seem to have a problem dealing with the same situation in a heavily populated area where it would be very unusual to be carrying a slung rifle, while the cop in the first video was dealing with a guy carrying a slung rifle in a very rural area, and handled it very badly.

What people expect from cops is that they would look at the second video and say "that's how it's done correctly" and look at the first video and say "that cop needs to be retrained, because he fucked up", not say "well, he's a fellow cop, so anything he did was fine, and the guy he was doing the wrong thing to is an asshole, and if you think the cop was wrong, you're an asshole too".
And when people get that attitude from the police, they naturally take a dim view of those police.
As my dad used to say, either do the job right, or don't do it at all.

 

Unusual, maybe, but not unheard of. Nor illegal.
I live in NH, and I grew up in a town with a population around 3300, so I'm somewhat familiar with the country.

 

I have to disagree with you here. I've seen it quite often. I live in a small town but I venture out into much smaller towns often and it is not as uncommon as you imply.

And TEXAS...come on, have you been around some of those towns? I would think that NOT having a firearm visible would cause more attention.

 

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear enough. I think that you don't understand my stance. I would not have a problem with an officer approaching the guy, questioning him in a professional manner, etc. That is after all...his job. Especially if someone had called expressing concern. That is NOT what the officer in the clip did. And put the environment into context, country road...would you feel any better if had been a 10/22? If so, why?

I think the cop in the second video did a hell of a job, I would hope that most cops would react that way. That is how they should be trained to do. He turned what could have been a bad situation into something positive and he probably shit on the guys filming the video's parade by being so professional. I don't condone anyone that goes out and tries to start a controversy where it is not needed. Those guys were just looking for confrontation in my opinion, that was an asshat move.

If you don't have any concern over that video and the direction that things are going; I think you may want to increase your understanding of the implications. No intention of an insult.

 

No shit Sherlock....of course OTHER THAN refute his remark at the 9:36 mark, which I clearly pointed out in my post.

As for the remainder of your nonsense, do YOU know anyone from that PD? What, NO? Then how the *^(% do you know what those cops think or are saying?
Also, did you see video footage from the very beginning of their interaction? Let me guess, another big fat NO....right? So you're just about as informed as everyone else in this matter. Wonderful! To think you spoke ill of those who condemned Zimmerman about not knowing the facts, didn't you? But yet, here you go.

Lastly, I just LOVE your synopsis on "attitude" from LE personnel, almost as if LE never receive one from the get go from a very large portion of the people they interact with.

 

Replace the AR in your sentence with a long gun that has a "tasteful wood grain stock", now is it normal? Is it more or less alarming?

I don't even live in the country and that's fairly normal around these parts.

I'm not saying I would do it, but...

 

It is pretty common here in texas. I dont do it. I know a bunch that do though.
We have hog problems, and they will mess people up.
a side piece wont help against a few hogs.

 

Let me stop you there, YOU nor anyone else who wasn't there knows what happen before the video began, right or wrong?


Also let's clear something up, do you think an AR toting individual should be subject to questioning OR as seen in these video's, and there are more than the two depicted in this thread, be able to essentially tell the officer to go pound sand?

CLEARLY, that has been the consensus with the videos I've seen, that a LEO cannot even ask for his information, ID, Firearm ID card, nothing!!!

What makes that position so damn amusing is that I'm pretty sure that if those same people were out to dinner with the family anywhere but beside a hunting lodge, they'd probably feel a little unsettled if they saw a half dozen guys walking in their direction with an AR strapped to their front.

Again, I'm as pro 2nd Amendment as one could get, but if you're seen with any firearm, you should be subject to questioning and have to provide ID. If everything's legit, you're on your way in no time.


Funny thing about the "good cop" in the second video, pretty sure that script would change in short order if he had 'followed' the so called law (according to some) and not engage those individuals only to find out 15 minutes later those guys took out 20 people at their local grocer. What would it be then, if found out that guy had saw them walking down the street earlier with the AR? F'ing moron? Incompetent AH? What?

 

damn I actually agree with your ass for once.

I am all for the right to bear an AR in MOST places...but also be able to answer questions to LEOs. I am not saying answer questions to some zimmerman wannabe...but if police stops you, answer his questions and move the fuck on.

cant get much simpler than that.

 

Also think if the police have a reason to interact with you then you should have to produce ID. They should be able to verify who theyre talking to and if theyre wanted etc.

 

A reasonable question from an LEO deserves a reasonable response. At that point, absent any evidence of illegal activity or intent, the interaction should end.

 

I think this is the crux of it. A reasonable question posed in a civil, respectful manner. And that it should be returned in kind.

Unfortunately, I think there is fair amount of stupid quite often on both sides.

 

I love the way you generalize.
Your video still has nothing to do with the first one.
"I guess there are a lost of people around here that commit crimes with their son next to them" is what you're focusing on.
You refute his statement concerning a father and son walking along a road in Texas with a rifle in plain view with a video of a traffic stop in Arkansas and a concealed weapon in a car, and that's one instance.
Not much in common there except a father and son combination and a rifle.
Different states, different circumstances.

You are correct that I haven't seen the video footage from the very beginning of their interaction. Maybe I could, since the cop's dashcam
recorded it but, oddly enough, they refuse to release the footage.

And you misunderstood my remark concerning attitude.
It referred to cops who stand behind the actions of any cop, no matter what the cop did.
Those who won't admit that cops sometimes do the wrong thing and should be called out on it, and lambast anyone that complains about anything that any cop does. That attitude.