MotoAmerica changes for 2018

My air cooled 848 / 1100 hybrid can keep up with middleweights no problem. Even down the straight at Roebling, the bike is very competitive. In AHRMA I ride in SOT 2 which is Triumphs, 848's, etc and I don't really suffer. Big tracks like Daytona I would be 10mph down, but compared to ANY SV, FZ, etc it's no contest. Even a strong 848 I can stay in the draft.

Of course it's an 1123 that cost about $12K to build. and nearly half of that went into the heads. Uber port job, big valves, etc.

Some of that research / development *might* cross over into a MA Monster 797 build, but I don't have the appetite to spend the big bucks on another Ducati project for a class I would be lucky to run mid pack in.

 

I was just pointing out that they have an indexing system in place.. For sure the bike isn't capable or designed to compete with middleweights. It looks like it would be a great street bike. A lot of fun.

 

That whole fla ccs air cooled class is nuts what those guys spend. I have a ton of respect for C Boy, he builds some insane stuff but it still boggles my mind the money spent for that 1 it maybe 2 class bike. If you can afford it, go for it as it’s their money but it still baffles me.

 

That bike doesn't apply to the conversation. The 848 is a sportbike (and one that has won Daytona back when it was an AMA race). It has race worthy chassis, brakes, suspension, aerodynamics, etc. It belongs in MW/SS racing.

We are talking about bikes like this KTM 790, which was build from the ground up to be an inexpensive street bike. Even if it does make 100+hp, it would be outgunned in the MW/SS classes.

 

So true. First year I raced my Aprilia/Yamaha hybrid I took it to a CCS event at RRR. There were 5 of those high dollar Bimota's from South Florida with the big air cooled Ducati motor. They were $32k just to buy one and then most of those guys poured even more bucks into their motors. In the classes I raced in I ran against several of them. None of them beat me which made me giggle since I spent a fraction of what they did to build my bike. Two uber fast SV guys beat me in one race (Bimota guys were way back) but those cats were turning high 1:15's. I kept behind them for a few laps but then decided it wasn't worth it and backed off slightly. A Honda RS250 GP bike beat me in another class. Fastest times I ever turned at RRR were chasing those guys.

 

Interesting... If you compare a typical stock middleweight 600 to the new 790 I don't see how you get that outcome.

Power - KTM wins by a long shot - 105hp (same for both) and torque is 63ft lbs VS 42-44ft lbs (675 omitted).

Weight - KTM is lighter out of the box by 10-15lbs

Chassis - nothing wrong with it and as you can see by KTM excelling every single class it has ever entered right from Dakar to Moto2, all it needs it clip-ons and slightly revised geometry and it'll be right there with any twin-spar aluminum chassis the Japanese have right now.

Brakes - same deal - everyone upgrades brakes for racing regardless so moot point however the stockers are supposedly pretty amazing for KTM branded calipers.

The only thing unproven of course is what happens with a build, how much potential there is in the engine - as you say you can easily get an additional 20hp from a 600 with a SS build and race gas or an SB build of course. Being a totally new platform, nobody has gone in and given this new 790 parallel twin engine the same treatment but history would say even if peak HP wasn't there the massive torque advantage would negate it anyways.

 

I agree with that 100%. My comment was more of a sidebar about how bad ass my CCS "Lightweight" bike is

 

It's 4 or 5 classes for CCS, so it makes a little more sense. LWGP, LWSB, GTL, Thunderbike, LWF40 (if you're 40).

Great for AHRMA too, SOT2, BOT, and SOT1 or FT if you don't mind racing up a class.

I agree it wouldn't make sense for WERA. And I would probably go a different direction if I was going to do the build now. But it's a great bike, low maintenance and I enjoy riding it. I don't think it's that crazy expensive for a class killing Superbike. Build an R6 to the limit (Livengood stage 4 or similar) you'll spend just as much if not more.

 

The numbers don't tell the whole story. My Big bore LW makes 126 on the MotoCorse dyno, and weights 385 with fuel. My R6 makes 123 on the same dyno and will out accelerate and out top-speed the LW any day.

 

I'd never argue otherwise, I was commenting because Chaotic said the numbers don't look good for the KTM VS a 600, so I posted that if it was all based on actual numbers/specs - the 790 in fact does match up and then some.

 

No. I never said it was all about numbers.

Actually, the point I was making was that the numbers don't tell the whole story. I said even if the KTM does make 100-110hp, it would still be heavily outgunned in a MW/SS race.

 

What kind of times at Roebling should that bike be capable of? A cheap SS SV can do 16's and 17's.

 

Couple of years back, Starnes and Mooney were doing :15's on the EBR and Panagale. This year Nate Kern won the race doing :16's on his BMW. So while a cheap SV may be able to do :16 with some superstar riding it, I think we can agree that that would be a top 3 pace? None of those caliber riders has ever ridden this bike so I'm not sure what it is truly capable of.

To answer your question, I think at most tracks, my LW can do whatever a 600 can. With the exception of maybe Road America or Daytona. Even with the big dyno numbers, it doesn't have the top speed. GPS says 155 or so around Daytona, whereas an R6 SS build will hit 170.

 

Hello Superstar

But really, tracks like RRR seems to be more of a who's going to stay wide open the longest rather than an acceleration thing.

 

lap record on SV is 1:16.260

One of those fancy 1000/1100/1123 air cooled ducs should be easily in 15s with right rider.

 

Yonce??

 

Stroud

 

yeah, that's kind of what I was getting at. I would think if you spent $12-15k on a lwt bike, it should be close to capable of doing 600 times.

 

Uber fast is Uber fast lol