Email from a serviceman...

I am not condoning what happened to the Iraqi prisoners...however, I think it is vitally important that in my head I have these matters in proper perspective.

* Saddam had Iraqi men, women and children put to death in human meat grinders on a daily basis...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

*Saddam had people thrown off of 3 - 4 story buildings, while their relatives were forced to watch...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

* Saddam had people's tongues cut out, limbs chopped of, and even beheaded, while their families were forced to watch...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

* Saddam's sons, as well as other Administrators and military
personnel raped and sodomized Iraqi girls, some as young as 8 years old, on a daily basis...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

* Saddam's regime indiscriminately put to death millions of Iraqi
citizens on a daily basis, during the term of his brutal dictatorship, as evidenced by the mass graves recently uncovered in various parts of Iraq...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

* Terrorists recently exploded several car bombs in Bagdad, killing 17 innocent Iraqi children and several dozen innocent Iraqi citizens...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

* Terrorists have been killing American/Coalition soldiers on a daily basis since we sent our troops, many of whom gave their lives on Iraqi soil, used US taxpayer dollars to liberate the Iraqi people...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

* Four Americans were killed in Fallujah, their bodies were
burned, mutilated, drug through the streets and hung on a
bridge...while Iraqi people cheered and stoned the bodies...NO OUTCRY FROM THE IRAQI PEOPLE OR THE ARAB COMMUNITY...

AND NOW, A FEW IRAQI PRISONERS HAVE BEEN HUMILIATED (poor babies)...A PAIR OF WOMEN'S UNDERWEAR PUT ON THE PRISONERS HEADS, A FEW NAKED PHOTOGRAPHS...AND THE IRAQI PEOPLE AND THE ENTIRE ARAB COMMUNITY GO BALLISTIC...GIVE ME A BREAK!!!

As I said, I don't condone what happened to the prisoners...but until the Iraqi's and the Arab Community gets their act together...I wish the American news elite would stop being part of the problem and stop using this story to the benefit of the Arab community.

I DON'T WANT MY PRESIDENT TO APOLOGIZE TO THE ARABS FOR ANYTHING! WE ARE AT WAR!

 

amen

 

well, my mind is changed!!!!

we should humiliate, torture, and/or kill every iraqi pow we can get our hands on!!!!
i mean, why not?
if saddam can do it, than we can do it better!!!!

come on guys, lets show the rest of the world that no one can humiliate, torture, and/or kill pows like america can humiliate, torture, and/or kill pows!!!!!!!!!!

WE'RE #1!!!!
WE'RE #1!!!!
WE'RE #1!!!!



does anyone not realize that if we do not hold ourselves to a higher standard than we become the monsters as well?

 

i don't venture into this section often, but here's my input.

it's a issue because it is a outsider (read non-arabic) doing the abuse, not your own race. it's like when a black man kills a fellow black man and it's considered normal, but if a white man kills a black man it is a race issue.

also the fact that a WOMAN is shown in the photos doing the humiliating/abuse/whatever. women in the arabic culture are the bottom of the food chain, for a non-arabic woman to be doing this is the ultimate in disgracing a arabic man.

yes, saddam was cruel to his race, but he was part of that race. the arabic religion teaches 1 supreme leader, not democracy (from what i understand), so saddam fit in with that culture. i'm not trying to defend him and what he did was sadistic, but that is just the way it is. what our soliders did is wrong and is lower than what saddam did. i hope that the soliders involved will be prosecuted in world court and punished, along with dishonorbly discharged. what they did is wrong and only served to disgrace this country.

don't think from the american eyes, but from the eyes of a arabic man to fully understand why it would piss them off. nevermind the fact that media has blown it up. at least that's my opinion, but since i'm young, i don't know what it's worth.

 

you are hoping for too much from this crowd.

to actually think about something as it relates to anyone other than an american will get you branded as anti-american and confused, or a worthless liberal, or just plain wrong.

other than that, great post!

perhaps there is hope for america's youth...

:up:

 

Considering the nature of what happened, it is disturbingly ironic that the president's humiliation is what seems to most bother you.

 

Let's put this in a racing context:

I want a really good race motor.

So as a mechanic i take a malfunctioning engine, rip it apart, do the internal work, then reassemble it in a better working manner.

The work in the middle is sometimes NASTY but the end result is a better functioning motor.
Pick your side and apply.

I'm in no means trying to justify what has been done to any individuals, just saying given times of war you find out what you are capable of.
YOU would be amazed. I no longer am.

Kinda like a suicide-watch guard given instructions, "If he tries to kill himself, shoot him."
Yep, it really happened

 

Re: Re: Email from a serviceman...

The letter was from an Army Lieutenant who gave his PERSPECTIVE. Did you even read the first part of his letter, or did you skip to the part about the President? You know, the most powerful man in the world? He already apologized for what happened, is punishing those responsible, and vowed to raze the prison where the abuses happened. To keep these abuses in PERSPECTIVE, this soldier gave you examples of what took place in this prison before the US got there.

 

Who would you rather live under:

Hussein or Bush

Who were the French supporting:

Hussein or Bush

Who was the UN supporting:

Hussein or Bush

Who would Kerry defer to:

The UN, the French and Hussein

Who do the enemies of the US want in power:

Hussein/UN/Kerry or Bush

I don't like everything Bush does; but all things equal I'd rather pay less taxes than more, and I'd rather have the enemy of my enemies in power here, than the friend of my enemies.

 

Re: Re: Re: Email from a serviceman...

Presumably you posted it because you agree with the lieutenant.

I ignored the first part of the letter because it is illogical to have expected Iraqis to complain to the same people who were killing them. Those who got out of the country did complain very loudly. And it was pointed out what a ruthless dictator did has no connection to what happened in the prison under american control.

Which wasn't just "humiliation." And like it or not, someone solely wishing the complaints and bad press would stop is tacitly condoning it.

 

I think the point that most are missing is the ironic outcry by people against the U.S. and not all of the other terrible things (that were much much worse on any scale) that were simply ignored before. I'm sure everyone would be much happier if Hussein were still in power. (it would appear)


Still waiting to hear ANYONE who opposes supply a better plan.

 

drivel, pure drivel...

how about we do not lie to the world for our reasons to go into iraq and then how about we treat the iraqi pows under the guidelines set forth by treaties that we have signed and claim to uphold.

just a suggestion...


who are you anyway?
where do you come from originally?
i am just curious... because your posts are consistent crap.

 

presumably this is justification for us to act in any fashion that we see fit no matter the consequences.

again, drivel, pure drivel...

 

Once again, the point missed. The U.S. POW situation was bad. But the irony is the ALL OF A SUDDEN outcry from arabs about THIS injustice, and not the others which were much worse. A perfect illustration. Luckily it is not all in the middle east, you've proved that it resides where you sit as well.

 

pure crap.

there were many arabs who spoke out about saddam's practices, just not that many in iraq.
apparently, he liked to do nasty things to anyone who spoke badly about him.

plus, there is a difference.
we came in a said that this stuff would not happen on our watch.
by golly, we are america and we do not do nasty things to people.

now, reply to my suggestions for a better plan in my previous pst, you seem to have forgotten to say anything about them.

also,

who are you anyway?
where do you come from originally?
i am just curious... because your posts are consistent crap.

 

Is it drivel? Or is it crap? I do love how everyone who you disagree with has "crap, or drivel" to say. Or, you can charge them as a pitiful man. Is it possible you could be more pompous than Papa? I believe it is.

 

Are you trying to say that CNN, and Al Jezzera whipped up the world's general population about those issues? Certainly not I Hope.

 

what a weak attempt.

there are plenty of people i disagree with on this bbs and very few that i say have only "crap, or drivel" to post.

you just happen to be one of them.

you skirt questions put to you and then have no accountability by skirting questions to who you are.

again,

who are you anyway?
where do you come from originally?
i am just curious... because your posts are consistent crap.

 

i do not understand exactly what you are asking.
what do you measn by "whipped up?"
are you asking about the people speaking up or the whether saddam did nasty things?

again,

who are you anyway?
where do you come from originally?
i am just curious... because your posts are consistent crap.

 

Who are you? I suppose this will be where you ask what credentialing someone has, or professional experience to speak to you? Totally predictable.