'02 R6 and gold valves

When putting a gold valve and heavier springs in my R6, is this all I need? I decided I could handle the $159 (g.v) and $110 (springs) cost to improve my stock forks but when looking over the racetech site, it seems I need to buy $159 rebound kit (?) plus all the seals, etc. OK, I know I need the right oil also. If I need all this "other" stuff, then it seems to cost the same as sending them out for work.

I know they'd probably be better from Thermosman, etc but can I just buy the gv, springs and oil and get something better?

Thanks,

Brad

 

If you're doing it yourself and don't know a whole lot about shim stacks you should go ahead and use the Racetech rebound valve. That way you'll get your shim stack info off their chart. Otherwise you're playing a guesssing game.

Consider that the majority of your damping is occuring in the rebound valve. It would be silly not to to spend the $159.

 

Also, the first generation R6's rebound piston is not re-buildable. Even if you wanted to play with the valving, you can't.

You need the parts, but once you're into it far enough to do the compression, it's not that much more work to replace the rebound parts.

Make sure you have the correct tools for the job, so you don't damage the cartridge taking it apart.

 

No need to replace seals and bushings unless you know they are worn out. Don't waste your money on RaceTech oil. The stuff is rediculously overpriced. The best suspension oils are the Redline and Silkolene Pro RSF brands with the Silkolene being less expensive. If you use another brand try to use their "suspension" fluid as opposed to their "fork" fluid. Most brands "suspension" fluid is of higher quality and will last longer and maintain a more consistent viscosity. Stick with one brand of oil because 5wt with one brand may be the same as another brands 10wt. The rebound valve is definitely worth it. You will notice a big difference over stock. I've found that having aftermarket valves as opposed to having someone else re-shim the stock ones has always worked better for me. Plus, you will know how to change you own shimming in the future if it's not right. Suspension tuning takes lots of experience and the more you play around with it yourself the better you'll get at doing your own setup.

 

Keep in mind, however, that the shim chart provided with the Racetech valves assumes the use of their oil. For example the rebound chart will give you a rating factor depending upon which of THEIR oils you are using.

It might be worth the $50 to establish a known baseline or you may want to consult this chart to find something as close as possible to the recommended oil. Note that the chart implies that Racetech is packaging Motorex.

 

With an Ohlins shim stack is it recommended to use their 'suspension' fluid or is OK to go with Redline, Silkolene or Motul?

 

thanks but more Q's....

Thanks a lot for the info. I'm confident I can do this work and I agree about doing it myself to increase my knowledge, etc. I have a few more questions though.

I figure it'll be about $430 for the GV, rebound gv, springs and oil. Could someone give me an idea what traxxion/thermosman/etc would apprx charge if I sent the forks to them? Just neighborhood guess is close enough for me.

Regarding special tools: do I need anything specific? I have all the usual stuff and a good vice/clamps.

My R6 has only about 900 miles on it. I bought it this spring with 220miles and it's only been on the track since so I'd imagine that the seals, bushing etc or in good shape. Never been down.

As a frame of reference, I race at Nelson Ledges, run mid 12's. I know I need to get into the 10's to be more competetive with even the fast wera novices. Bike is stock down to the jetting and pipe (but just ordered an Ivans jet kit).

Thanks for the help folks!

Brad

 

I talked to Mike Fitzgerald the other day and he quoted me a price of $600 for everything. As far as Traxxion is concerned their website I think says $700. Pretty reasonable I think because if you want to do it correctly you have to go buy the tools to get it done right. I priced all the tools out to be about $250-$300 depending on how high end you want to get. Spend about another $350 for a shim stack/compression & rebound and then you're right up there with them doing it anyway and they won't F()c|< it up like I will because I don't know the top of the fork from the bottom.

 

Re: thanks but more Q's....

Aluminum vice blocks with a "V" groove, the appropriate size aluminum shaft/cartridge holding tools are the required ones. You can make shaft holding tools by drilling then slicing some hardwood if you are really feeling cheap. Same applies to the V-notch vice blocks. Leather/rubber pads help if you're desperate.

A torque wrench.........

You can get creative with PVC pipe for a seal driver.

A micrometer and/or a very accurate set of vernier calipers is required to sort your shims.

 

Why not get ohlins valving? I did the racetech revalve and honestly I wasnt that impressed. Well lets say that I have not been $400 worth of impressed yet.

Do it yourself if you enjoy this sort of stuff but it is frustrating and tedious. The remove and replace portion is fairly easy but the dialing it in is where it gets difficult. I think I had changed my shim stack 4 times in one day just seeing what the differences would feel like.

The racetech site gives you some generic instructions along with so called custom settings and stack. Dont expect much more than a couple of pieces of paper and some stack settings that are pretty across the board. Its not bad stuff but if I had to do it all over again I would get the ohlins internals.

 

I agree the Ohlins are a better product but they give you next to zero support if you install them yourself. Plus, the instructions for installation don't give you any information about how to dissasemble your cartridges. If you have experience with replacing the fork valves and understand shimming than the Ohlins are the way to go. The instructions that RaceTech gives you about how to dis/re-assemble the cartridges are almost worth the money by themselves. I use the Ohlins myself and they are definitely a little better than the RaceTechs but I would never have figured out how to install them without having used the RaceTech kit for my first time.

 

True, but think maybe we could walk him through? I hate to see a guy buy a lesser product just for the horrible instructions.

 

And the difference in quality between a stack of steel shims from RT and a stack of steel shims from Ohlins is what?

And the shims are sourced by those companies from?

 

The actual valves are way different.

 

And besides passing oil to the shims without restriction and providing a sealing surface they perform what function?

 

Well if you have to ask that then you really do not understand how they work in the first place. You asked a question I answered it and then you roll your eyes at the answer.

 

OK. Sorry I "rolled my eyes" at you. But I wasn't asking for a date.

The question remains. If the valve body has orifices large enough to pass the fluid without restriction at the anticipated velocities AND is machined flat enough to seal the shims, what else would you like it to do? Are you concerned with differences in the adjuster needle taper? Bleed hole size? Spring/wave washer quality?

Put another way. What engineering difference is there between the two valves which makes the Ohlins product functionally superior?

 

It all has to do with how they flow the oil. Yes you can revalve one to mimic the other but right out of the box the 2 different vlaves will act completely different.If you do not uderstand the dynamics of the oil flow than you can not adjust the shim stack to do what you want it to.

 

If the valve body itself is controlling the fluid flow in lieu of the shim stack isn't that a step backwards in the direction of V2 orifice control? Are you saying that the Ohlins valve holes are influencing the fluid flow by restricting it? Or are you implying that the RT valve has a problem with restricting the flow?

What "dynamic" influence are we talking about?

 

First let me make it clear that I am not saying anyonevalve/piston is better than the other. I am just saying that they will damp differently and some riders might like one better than the other.

The valve is controlling the way the oil "hits" the shim stack. The shim stack acts to damp the flow of oil through the piston. The way the piston is designed will greatly effect how the oil flows through it, which will in turn dictate how you build the stack to damp it.

Think of it like this......If you take a faucet that puts out 15 gpm and hook a 1/2" hose to it you will get the same flow but at a higher pressure than if you hook a 1" hose to it.