Is this in my head or what?

Can someone tell me why I can turn a 5 second faster lap time on Dulop 208's than I can on Pirelli Super softs? I was on Pirelli's at Putnam this weekend and couldn't get to the time I turned 2 weeks ago on the the Dunlops. What is up with this. Very frustrated.

 

Shall we start with the easy stuff? Different profiles maybe. How about different carcass. Someone once told me to pick a tire and stick with it, no pun intended.

 

Did you set your bike up for the new tires....have you ever set your bike up....if not did you buy it set up...if so maybe it was set up for Dunlops and unless you are gifted like the guys that get a salary to ride or can win cup races, it usually takes some practice to learn the new tires to push them.

 

Tires are 99% mental.

In your case 99% = 5 seconds.

 

Run the green rear on ****

Pirelli's turn slower and slide a little more, but stick just as well.
Setup may need changing, but if the 208's were working that wouldn't be my first choice.
Just run them a little more about 30psi I would imagine, they are a little pressure sensitive.

 

My bike was set up on the Dunlop 207's, and what I can tell the 208's are much of the same tire. My confidence is much higher with the dunlops. When I rode the Pirelli's I couldn't feel anything. I felt like my bike would let go in every corner. I noticed the Dunlops are very predictable, when they slide I could ride it out and they would hook up and go. The pirelli's never did slide and I felt if I pushed them I would crash. I am sure the Pirelli's are great tires, I am just amazed at the difference in feel. Thanks for your inputs.

 

Tire circumference?

 

What SClark said. You have confidence in the 208s and you don't yet in the Pirellis. I don't know what bike you are running but I ran 207s on a 75hp EX early last year and then switched to Pirelli for the contigency money. Once I developed confidence in the Pirellis my lap times really came down and I got about $3000 worth of tires out of them, plus two regional C-ships. This year I'm running a TLR with the Pirellis. They stick great and are predictable, not to mention that they hold up pretty good too. I run the blue ( super soft) front and the green (soft) rear. 31 pounds front and 30 rear. I hated to give up my Dunlops but in hind sight I'm glad now that I did. Dunlop is a good tire but I've found that the Pirelli works great for me, plus they have a good contingency program. FWIW, the Metzelers are the same tire, just a different tread pattern. Give them a chance, you might be surprised. Dean

 

Pardon me, but isn't "slide a little more, but stick just as well" rather contradictory?

I run Michelin on the track, Dunnies on the street...but have a few of my team-mates running Pirelli's (and they like 'em). It really comes down to the mental game (see aforementioned posting) and if you prefer faster turn-in v.s. smoother transition (or V profile v.s. round profile).

 

instead of worrying about tires, I found that I could really increase my lap times by opening up the bleeders on the front brakes.

 

Hey Eric, that's a great idea. It saves on brake pads and front tire wear. Frees up your right hand to concentrate on the throttle. Saves on rotors. The down side is that you have to learn to make new faces and say OH S^%T!! different ways to keep form boring yourself. And Eric, I don't think going across the grass from turn 4 to turn 8 leaving out turns 5 6 7 because you couldn't slow down constitutes lowering your lap times.

 

Hey Eric, I just read your post a little closer. I apologize. You did say "increase" your lap times by opening the bleeders. I guess you weren't making it all the way across the grass after all.

 

Try it out... after turn 1, "it" will pucker up so tight you'll not find the opening for week.
I discovered this technique by accident... I replaced the fluid trackside and didn't get all the air out. I went out to practice, went into turn one and NOTHING.
Being rather slow, I began recommending the bleeder-techniue to my competition, thinking it might improve my standings...

Well hell, if the GP guys can cut across the rumble-strips I figured there's no harm in cutting a corner. And going from 4 to 8 means I really only cut one, the other three were just in the way.



[This message has been edited by Eric (edited 10-25-2001).]

 

How about giving us a time.

 

Going into turn one at Putnum with no brakes and not binning it??????????

 

You guys are right, I just need to go in faster and twist the throttle more and use less brakes. I am racing a Duc 996 and at the end of the straight at Putnam that beast is hauling butt and my pucker factor is through the roof. I am amazed at the difference in the tires. While I am riding I am saying to my-self this is slow just twist it and go faster, but my confidence and feel through the tires won't let me. On the Dunlops I turned a 1:23 and on the Pirelli's I was no better than a 1:28. I understand that my 23 is very slow to a lot of the guys but I need to find some more time to be competitive. Thanks for all your help and input.

 

drmike...please don't take this in any way as an insult, it's not, just a suggestion. if you are riding a 996, on good race rubber and it has had suspension re-work done to it, doing mid 20's at putnam, it's quite possible that you're going too slow for the suspension to work properly. try a slightly softer setting at both ends and see if that improves your feel. adjust it as you go faster. again, please don't be offended, rob.

 

Switched from Dunlops to Pirelli mid-season on our Aprilia Cup bikes.

The setup was *totally* different for the pirelli. IMHO it's due to the really soft carcass on the pirelli. They're also VERY sensitive to pressure settings, you have to be very anal or the blues will come apart (literally...they shread) in about 12 laps.

I think they're both great tires. Setup is easier with the Dunlops... the pirellis just seem to be really picky. We switched because of supply problems with 160 rear tires... first only Dunlop had them, then they started not having them and pirelli did (plus they offer a GREAT contingency program, and Moose at Trackside is super to deal with!).

Once you get the bike set up for the pirellis, they're awesome. Chasing the setup takes some time. We run blue/blue on the Cup bikes (60hp doesn't exactly eat rear tires) and Brian K has 3-for-3 (1st, 2nd, 2nd) podium finishes at the VIR, Poconno, and Daytona F-USA events.

Just my $.02 as always.
- Brian Roach

 

Robw122 thanks for the suggestion. My suspension is very tight compared to my fellow Duc riders. I think I will have Max at Traxxion Dynamics, check my suspension. Again thanks for everyones input. One day maybe I will be able to go around Putnam at a decent pace.

 

If I may be so bold there is a fellow in Louisville, that set up my front end for me. His shop is called the Suspension works and his number is (502) 423-9513 cant remember his name off hand. Anyway, I havent touched my forks all year and I ran three different tracks. Putnam, Gingermann and Nelson and the front has always felt stuck to the ground. Using me as an example I can turn consistent 1:20 laps on my 95 YZF 600. Might want to check him out, he might be able to educate you as well.