MotoAmerica / Road America

so can someone tell me why a 4cyl 1000cc ducati shouldn’t be alllwed to race against 4cyl 1000cc honda’s, yamahas, kawasaki’s???

because price? because it makes too much power? lol the power thing is a joke. ducati is constantly innovating and bringing new shit to the market. they keep pushing that bar which in turn forces the other manufacturers to do as well.

i guess we could have a grid full of 175hp 10yr old honda’s.


this is the same bullshit bautista and rea went through in wsbk last year when people cried fowl the duc had more revs and therefore an advantage.

how about instead of complaining the other manufacturers make a better bike?

don’t punish the innovator.

 

If you look at the post I made about the 2020 stock 1000 rules, it states that 2020 stock 1000 machines have to be FIM homologated "superstock 1000." To Mesa's point, the Panigale V4 isn't homologated for FIM superstock 1000, and it would be over the pricing restrictions of that class as well.

Them's the rules. I personally think the V4 R should be allowed to run, but per the rulebook it appears a strong case could be made that the bike is illegal.

 

I'm sure MA would come up with some reason for why they allow it, even though it's not on the sheet that has been linked like 10 times so far. Otherwise it wouldn't have passed tech to begin with. If someone showed up with a KTM 790 in Twins cup, it would never make it on track even cuz it wouldn't pass tech. PJ's bike did...for whatever reason.

Nevertheless, when I first saw PJ, Stk1000, and Ducati V4 all in the same sentence, my first thought was "Ducati about to win a championship in the US finally!" I can't be mad about that, as much as I would like to see Mesa win, since he's a local guy.

 

I've wondered this myself. The new gen S1000RR has been out 2 years now. Freddie at SBU is building up a badass full on 2020 S1000RR SBK using Alpha Racing WSBK-spec parts as we speak. Something like THAT is what Herrin should be riding.


...or at least their equally impressive ZX-10RR sbk

 

Yea, MA is not about to chase Celtic HSBK away regardless of what the rules say.

Does make me wonder what PJ could do on V4R Superbike. I don't think he could challenge Beaubier, but could he give the M4 guys and Scholz a run for their money?

 

Well you recall, a few years back when our good old friends from Daytona group were getting ready to take over AMA Roadracing......


ELKHART LAKE, WIS, JUNE 7: American Suzuki is prepared to withdrawal its support from the AMA Superbike Championship if the currently proposed set of rules is enacted.

That was the word from Mel Harris, American Suzuki’s vice president for motorcycles and ATV’s, at Road America on Saturday afternoon. Asked directly if American Suzuki would race next year, Harris said, “I don’t think you’ll see us racing if the rules stay the way they are now.”

Harris supports the rules originally endorsed by the American distributors of the Japanese manufacturers for the 2009-2010 Superbike class. Daytona Motorsports Group CEO Roger Edmondson agreed to those rules in the Literbike class, but only if each manufacturer guaranteed four motorcycles in qualifying. (They didn’t have to be factory machines.) But the cost of having four Superbikes was prohibitive and Yamaha’s Keith McCarty suggested a move to more restrictive, and less expensive, rules. Edmondson then gave the American bosses of the Japanese factories a choice; the 2009-2010 rules or more restrictive regulations. Harris was the only senior executive who never responded to the query.

“I haven’t answered him yet, because I was waiting for what the factory to give me more direction,” he began, “because with Suzuki being a small company, we can’t be racing different rules all over the world. We need to be racing rules that make sense.” The rules which cap horsepower for the Literbike class at 185 horsepower, and Daytona Superbike at 140, depending on the weight of the motorcycle, don’t make sense to Suzuki and make it difficult to predict the future.

“I can’t tell you the plan” for 2009, “but I can tell you I’m not racing the rules that were just presented,” he said. “I mean I don’t think that that’s best for us and that’s not best for the industry. So I think that there’s still a lot of talking that needs to be done before everybody gets ready to put on a show for next year.”

Suzuki has always been more interested in racing 1000’s, specifically the GSX-R1000, and that was where they’d focus their efforts, if the rules changed, Harris said.

“You know, we haven’t really been in the 600 Formula Xtreme or that much with 600’s,” he said. “Either class you go in, the costs are about the same, so you can’t go into two classes, so you have to go in one. Well, all of our development is in the 1000’s. As I look at it, it’s easy (use) 1000’s to sell 600’s, but will 600’s sell 1000’s? And we sell a lot of big bikes.

“So at this point we want to race in the 1000 class, but we want to race with rules that make sense. I still say the rules that all the manufacturers agreed with for two years, we at least ought to give it a shot. No spec tires, no spec gas, no holding ECU’s. Let’s just race like men out there. Do the right thing.” Edmondson has said there will be a control tire and a control fuel supplier. The requests for proposals will go out once the technical rules have been finalized.

Harris also said it would be more helpful if there were consistent rules among the various Superbike championships worldwide. For the American distributor to race completely different rules, which, to a point they do now, “just doesn’t make sense. Our company’s not big enough to support all that kind of activity. At this point we’re still waiting and they’ve kind of given me their ideas, so now I can probably sit down and talk a little bit more with people and see what we can do.”

More ominously, Harris also said that if American Suzuki didn’t race, they’d wouldn’t support any other teams. Currently, they’re the largest supporter of satellite teams and privateers in the paddock. Among their premier satellite teams are Jordan Suzuki, M4 EMGO Suzuki, and Matsushima Performance Suzuki.

“Well, if we’re not racing, it would probably be pretty tough to give all the support out,” he said.

 

I think so.

Freddy is building these bikes, so clearly people have money. Wish these guys would enter some MA rounds (not Freddy as he supports the series, but his customers). I also know a lot of those guys may not be able to deal with being humbled that much though.

 

Yeah, I'm all for if you've got the money to spend then build yourself whatever tickles your pickle.....but there is still that tiny little infinitesimally small part of me that is like why the hell are you building a WSBK-spec rig to do trackdays and club races

 

All the bikes sbu build are awesome and Freddy can tune the hell out of a bike

 

I was really hoping to see Freddy put someone on that ZX10RR he built and try to get a few MA rounds in.. He builds awesome bikes with super trick parts, but after they're done i never see them racing much..

FWIW just my $0.02... I think the V4R is just fine for the STK1000 class, but I have a hard time thinking PJ belongs there.. He's raced at a world level, and although he may have never run MASBK, I think his experience and talent should mandate a bump to SBK. He's clearly fast enough. Whats to stop Scott Redding from flying over and doing a few rounds of ST1000 on a prepped V4R? He's never run MotoASBK?

I aint mad, though.. racing is back and it feels fuckin good, boys.

 

I'm kind of shocked at how many people are defending a rulebook that is variable based on which team it applies to. Rules are there for a reason. The argument that PJ is fast anyways doesn't override the fact that he wasn't within the rules of the race he entered. (as far as I can tell from what is posted on here.) Motoamerica supposedly making hidden agreements to rules changes without broad notification to the rest of the field puts others at an advantage and delegitimizes the series in my opinion.

 

The rear brake on that ZX-10 must get really Hot . Look at all those Cooling Ports carved into the rear rotor

 

I was hopeful that they would enter MA this year, they said they were seriously considering entering a team. I guess they couldnt get the sponsorship part figured out.

 

SBU made an Instagram post in Jan/Feb saying they were willing to partner with someone and race the ZX10 in MA SBK. I honestly thought I'd see Herrin on that bike.

Part of me thinks the Superbike Cup thing is a test to see if Stock 1000 rules for the premier class would be palatable for the fans and teams alike to further drive down costs, if there is a big cost difference between SBK and STK1K.

I would think that MA/KRAVE have spoken to industry leaders about what MA would have to do to get their involvement in the series. For many, I'm sure it's the factories writing checks again.

 

Interesting comment from Bryce Prince.

 

Stefano didn’t submit a formal protest and neither did the rest of the Stock 1000 field. Until someone does, this is all just pissing into the wind.

 

I can't believe you guys are saying Mesa doesn't have a case- the bike is not homologated. I.e. it's illegal! When MA allowed Bob Robbins to run the Monster 796 as a test, it was with the agreement that they would be removed from the results, which happened when they took 3rd at NJMP. Ducati subsequently homologated the 797.

Stefano is literally there with his mom and dad, no extra crew. They made a 1500 mile drive to try and get some Kawasaki $$ and he was knocked out of that money by an illegal bike- and if this was you, you would not complain, right?

GMAFB.

 

He should not have to protest. They should have stopped that cold when he entered the race on an illegal machine. This is a professional series. You should not have to show up not knowing if they are going to bend the rules for someone else.

 

He also stated he went up to protest and M.A. told him not to waste his time.

 

Remember last year when the Brembo master wasn't homoligated for twins, and we all had to run around changing to stock masters or get DQ'd.

Same thing, just the whole bike isn't homoligated. It's not rocket appliances. It's on the 'legal bike list' or it's not.... it's not.