Trackday Liability ??????

See, now not to stir the pot, but clearly the rules were set for a reason, then they were changed. That doesn't seem good for the org.

I know what you mean, it's more fun running in the back of A, you get plenty of clear track until the fast guys lap you

 

No, no, no

Yes, you most certainly can and should get a accident report for any serious or fatal accident that occurs at any vehicle race track in the state of New Jersey!

You have to review your state laws as they differ from state to state. New Jersey State Police regulate all race tracks in the State of New Jersey. NJ State Troopers even have a office at NJPM.

Chapter 62 The Vehicle Race Track Rules link http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/info/pdf/racing_regulations.pdf

NJ State Police Motor Vehicle Racing Control Squad Duties

1. Ensure compliance with racetrack regulations at race events.
2. Investigate serious and fatal crashes and incidents occurring at race events.
3. License race tracks throughout the state.
4. Inspect race tracks prior to and during events to ensure that all safety requirements are operational and in place.
5. Maintain records and statistics for the racing industry.
6. Research applications for rule modifications.
7. Coordinate Civilian Advisory Board that periodically meets to discuss pertinent racing issues.
8. Formulate, amend and re-adopt Chapter 62, the Motor Vehicle Race Track Rules.

 

yes, trackdays are usually sold out here. A is normally the least popular group (fills up last), but normally trackdays are full. B group is the most popular group.

 

It's easier to get faster in the A group. You don't have riders on bigger bikes passing you in the straights, and then parking in the turns...

I have no problem with getting passed by people that know how to ride. :up:

 

That's good to know! :up:

 

BrianK, just look in the sig 3 posts up.

 

And THAT'S the dilemma.....
I waited a pretty long time before I moved up to A, because I didn't want to be the crazy guy out there doing unpredictable things. When I did move up, I realized it wasn't necessarily about lap times.

I would feel completely safe putting my wife in the beginners group with STT.
The B group, however...... there are some crazy mofo's out there.

 

Problem is, most of them don't know any riding techniques, but think they're riding for a contract...

EDIT: I'm talking about the "crazy mofo's", not the average B group rider. Just wanted to clear that up.

 

:up::up::up::up:

 

I know this thread has been completely jacked, and I apologize to the op, but I swear there is more competition and less comradery in the average B group than in racing. That's weird.

 

^ my theory is it's sort of like teenage/adolescent angst. it is that transitional zone where you want to get faster but you don't quite have the precision yet, etc... plus, the skill is there for an ego to start being developed.

 

Sorry, Atfullean.

How's your brother doing?

 

depends

Yikes, that sucks. Whether there is any liability could depend what state. If it happened in california, let me know, I can get you some info.

 

Well in all honesty, he's got a rod in his femur as pictured, had 3 broken ribs and collarbone. Accident was with STT AND AS MENTIONED NOT EVEN A CARD ! we as td riders hv accepted the dangers but a little courtesy wouldve been nice ! He's walking now and riding at about75% for the street so that's 50% track! I'm gonna get him a suit for Xmas and see how he likes dem apples !lol
he was just about to by a lap timer to shoot for the a group, in sure he will as soon as his game and strength are up to speed !
Fellas, I appreciate all the info especially about the group hazzards, I will def keep that n mind !

 

Like one person said, no organization has 100% relief from proven negligence. That's why they have (need) insurance.

I really hate law suits, and i think that's one of the major faults of this county is the litigious nature of everyday life. But as I step down from the soap box, I would not be surprised if incidents like this one are not the catalyst for one. Maybe there's more to the story that what was posted, like maybe the rider brake checked, changed lines, or what have you. Don't want to start placing blame, but without both sides of the story, we have no way of making an honest call.

Either way, some of the stuff that's been going on at track days lately is just unreal. Not just people who sign up, but control riders and even TD owners to say the least. I'll leave it at that; not going to mention names online.

Never thought I would be safer at an actual amateur race, but after doing my first one last summer, I can honestly say it was safer than most track days I've been to. Some exceptions of course, and it does appear that some clubs are making an effort to establish tougher rules. Let's hope it gets better for 2010.

 

customer service at its finest. :up:

 

...then there's the one about the two "I" group CR's engaged in what essentially amounted to a dick-slinging contest, and one of them tags another rider (paying customer) from behind, gets it on video, then POSTS the video on YouTube accusing the rider that got "ass-packed" of insufficient skill. ISN'T THAT WHAT YOU'RE THERE FOR, DOUCHE?!?

personally, i think all TD orgs should adopt the more formal bump system AND ENFORCE IT so that the customer is vetted and placed in the appropriate group...when i get to the A grid with NESBA, i am fairly confident that nobody there is going to try to kill me in the next twenty minutes.

sorry to hear about you brother, always. stuff like this never helps the sport.

 

I've ridden with 8 different track day organizations, which includes one local motorcycle shop running a track day, and I've ridden on the following 6 different tracks: NJMP, BeaveRun, Mid-O, Nelson Ledges, Summit Point, and Pocono FUSA.

I have seen very professional TD organizations that stick to their rules even if their group did not fill up, and I have seen TD organizations merge groups or even run an "open track event" after advertising a three group format.

I doubt this is news to anyone here, but there are skill groups for a reason. Check out your TD organization thoroughly before you lay down your hard earned cash and drive 3 or 4 hours to the track.:up:

In defense of the TD organizations, I understand that they have to make money and need to fill their slots, but at some point, the rules should not be bent to accomodate profit.

I do agree that getting more attorney's involved in our sport will only lead to track closures or astronomical prices.:down:

 

What is the traditional bump system?

I just started doing TD this year, but I was able to get 15-16 of them in, so I have a little experience. The org I ride with catches some flak on here (I think, unless I am reading wrong). I think they do a good job, in both controling and coaching. However, NJMP, as it is well known, was a big problem this whole past season... and was a microcosm of the "crap" that goes on at some track days. I got lucky, as I had no incidents all season, and I wasent caught in any of the flying shrapnel known as "intermediate group"... it does make me glad that I am in advanced group now, as I think it will be a bit safer.
But when people make stupid moves it takes away from everyones enjoyment.

Kneescraper: I too have been to a few combined days as well as completely open track events. As you would expect I heard alot of complaining from "fast guys" that had to share the track with "slow guys" which is understandable. I have also heard the defense that open track events and combined groups are not safe and I agree somewhat. I dont know if I got lucky or what, but the three combined/open days I did, were the safest, trouble free days I went too this season. However, the days that were advertised as a normal 3 group event, which were then changed last minute to combined/open format were clusterfucks. I dont know if the people that agree/want to ride in a combined format are more mature riders or what... but I know if I sign up for a 3 group event next year, and it is changed to a combined event at the last minute... I will go home.