yes, Justice Scalia, you were wrong

It's a lot easier to release someone from prison than it is to resurrect the dead.
The death penalty has it's place, but it should be pretty rare to avoid a mistake that can not be remedied. Does anyone here think that Timothy McVeigh did not deserve to die?

 

ok fargo.

 

they can be freed.
easter only comes once a year.

 

I said early on that I think the death penalty should be applied in the rare cases where there was no doubt. I don't care if they had "mental" issues or anything else, if they murdered without reason (self defense) they should be put to death when there is no doubt. If there is doubt, I don't think they should receive the death penalty in the first place. The entire sentence is screwy now, life sentences with 10, 20 or whatever years before parole...many are on death row and will remain their for years and years without ever being executed. But, if they weren't going to ever be released...who is it doing any good to keep them there? Is that supposed to make the victims or the unishiek feel better? if so, does that justify it?

Oddly enough, where I'm living now has public executions on the cheap and wouldn't cha know...crime is much lower here. I certainly feel less threatened here than I do in many neighborhoods in the U.S.

And before blow hard starts up again...I grew up in black neighborhoods.

 

I never disagreed with that HOWEVER, the anti- DP'ers do NOT endorse that mindset, they want it removed......... period. I have yet to see one of them say, "Yes, I'll support the DP so long as it's purely used for SOLID cases".....Actually I feel confident in saying I've NEVER seen one of those types admit to that.

"They can be freed"?????....tell that to the poor guys who rotted 10, 20 or 30 yrs of their life away in prison. Using the DP rationale, I just don't see how we can risk an innocent life being thrown away like that....you guys are going to have to work harder to convince me prison is a needed institution.

 

You are so hood!

 

Bring back hard labor for convicted prisoners and have them grow their own food and I will go 100% against the death penalty

 

I was talking about people who get time vs dp...they can eventually be freed. You cant free somebody after you kill him. I am not saying that makes everything right...If i am wrongfully locked away for years, the state better pay me some dough and even that wont bring back the years lost.
Do you think they would take the DP after all that time?

What would your alternative be to prison?

 

one of my cattle ranches used to be a sugar cane plantation.
It was started right after the civil war and used rented prisoner labor. I have some pretty cool artifacts from that place. They even bred their own kind of chase dog.

 

I know you didn't ask me, but I'd like to toss victim restitution out for consideration.

 

ya, as long as it isnt the saudi kind.

In SA, if you commit murder and are about to get the sword, you can buy your way to freedom as long as you pay the victims family.

It is getting out of control there with these....family members will kill family members and then frame a rich dude to get paid.

 

I could actually get behind this. I also think it would reduce repeat offenders. I wouldn't kid myself and say crime would stop but I do think the notion of labor...any kind of labor terrifies many that are in prison now.

Didn't prisons prisons once produce products to help fund the prison? I think it was politicians that put a stop to that but not sure.

And the 40.00 a day cost per prisoner posted earlier by my arch rival on this thread is B.S. That is extremely optimistic figures and in no way reflects reality. The cost varies from state to state but I think the overall average is around 30k per year. That is probably more than the average workers salary.

 

I get approached all of the time by family or tribe members asking for money to free their member. It is getting out of hand, millions are being paid now. There is a case now where the family has set the amount that it will take for them to pardon the guy. I think it's something like 50 million srl's.

 

Brazil has a great system for that. According to my Brazilian friends...if someone murders another person and goes to prison, the children of the murderer get a paid education. The children of the victim...not so much.

 

where did you get your figures?

TDC figures...real figures released by TDC states it would cost about $17,340 to house an inmate for a year and $693,500 for 40 years.

This is according to Michelle Lyons who is the spokes person for TDC...but i am sure you know better.

 

who pays for the education?

 

With the framing thing, no shit?! That's pretty crazy. However, the paying a victim's family thing as justice is a typical feature of many non-industrial cultures. The problem there seems to be that they have retained elements of their traditional culture in the justice system, but in a much different era than when those practices made sense.

 

There may still be some prisons that still produce a product. In GA, convicted prisoners (minimum security)can get released to work crews. The prisoners get the benefit of not staring at the walls all day and to state theoretically gets some benefit from their labor. Of course the prison crews can't work if it is raining, too hot or too cold...you know, conditions our regular employees endure all the time. It isn't zero cost, but at least the cost of housing them is defrayed by the work they perform. I'm not sure how they calculate the cost per day for housing them, but the $40 to $50 number is used in our budgets, so it is recognized as having some basis in fact.

 

WIKI, or maybe this would be better?
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/24/n...-inmate-is-nearly-168000-study-says.html?_r=0


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States