Question for Sprint-Endurance racers

I'm curious about something...

I have a friend that has always raced a lightweight/vintage bike, but recently got a modern 600. He's gonna endurance race it (mostly solo iron-butt type stuff) but says he's not really interested in racing sprints. I think he feels like people take more chances and ride more aggressively in sprints.

So my question is for racers who do sprints AND endurance: Do you think people race more aggressively in sprints than they do in endurance? Are they a little more courteous and patient in endurance races? I don't necessarily think my friend is wrong or anything; it seems like a fairly logical assumption. I'm just curious if that might not actually be the case.

And PLEASE people... I'm not interested in starting an argument about whether people should be more aggressive or should be more patient. I'm asking whether or not they are.

Thanks.

 

I race both and although you can definitely pick the two different riders out, it's not that endurance racers are nicer on the racetrack, as I've been passed a little dirty and have probably returned the favor. The purse winnings are definitely bigger in most of the endurance races as well, so people don't pull punches when there is good money to be won. However, they are definitely much more aware of what their tires are doing, and thus pick and choose much more carefully where they need to pass versus where they want to pass as well as their other inputs on the bike. Where as with sprint races, tire wear is not much of an issue over the course of just seven laps, nor is rider fatigue.(for the most part.) The environment change though, especially in the 600 class sprint races causes the first turn to be a parking lot because 4 or 5 guys are fighting for the same position all across the track, after that things begin to space out a bit.
Having said all that, endurance racing is the shizzy and a great bang for the buck. I can't wait to do a full season of it.

 

In sprints you might see some last lap type of passes that you wouldn't see in endurance but its pretty similar other than than. There are times when I might wait a corner or two later to make a pass on a slower bike or a bike that is not in your class because you know you don't have to get er done in 8 laps. Tire conservation might enter into your first hour riding and tire management near the end - when your tires are crapped out. I've swapped paint during an endurance race though and since there are usually multiple classes running at the same time you can see some huge speed differentials. Picture SV650's getting passed by Tray Batey on a superbike GSXR 1000 (or Kevin Schwantz at last years Road Atlanta race at the GNF, how cool was that!)

 

Yeh, I tagged knees with a guy at VIR this past year along w/ swapping some paint and since I was on a 600RR this particular race we had some of the more competitive teams BLOWING by on their GSXR1000/R1 Superbikes and I definitely had a few harrowing passes going both ways that definitely got my attention.

 

Well, I learned the hard way to be more patient during endurance races. I punted Tony P. in turn 7 @ VIR and watched him sail through the air. All because I tried to run under him into the turn. Luckily we both walked away, but it could have been bad. I was also lucky that Tony is such agreat guy and didn't shoot me for my obvious stupidity. I think you can ride aggressively and carefully by riding smart, aware, and knowing your limitations. It also helps to know the riding abilities of those you are racing with.

 

Frome a newbs point of view.
I came into racing knowing that I wanted to go the endurance route. I did a couple of races at Tally and Roebling and I can say people WILL take more chances and risk in sprint races at least in the novice level. Hell, I've swapped paint in practice because a guy couldn't check his ego. (long story) In those two races I could count like eight O-shit moments.

While doing 6 rounds of endurance I had two... Seems like people have a mind set that the need to finish the race instead of making a questionable decision.

Just my opinion.

 

Turn 7 huh? I have had two friend get bumped off in turn 7, one of them actually got hit in the shoulder by another racer's front wheel just because the other guy was being wreckless. He managed to keep it up, but it screwed him for the race. Needless to say he wasn't happy about it.

 

Turn 7 is also tricky, it closes up on you and wicked stuff can happen to good people real easy there. I've definitely experienced high amount of "pucker factor" there.

 

I have a similar background as your friend. I run lt.wt. sprints (DSB,V6LW) and also run ltwtsb some in endurance racing. From my experience, I think that generally it is true that the passing is more conservative than in the sprint classes that I run. The exception is the beginning and end of the endurance race. The first time or two the leaders come by can be a little...umm...exciting. The leader is trying to make a break and those chasing don't want to let him get away. Ain't nobody going to slow either of them up. And for some reason, near the end of the race, the passing tends to get a little sloppy. No explanation unless it is fatigue or a last mad dash to the end.
Steve

 

Yeh, I had both leaders come by one time....at the same time, spooked me a bit and had to really focus hard to make sure that I made it into the next turn you know. Definitely know what you mean there.

 

Hell yes, no question

The smart riders in endurance know you can't win it in the first corner, or even on the first lap.

But you can sure as hell lose it there.........

 

Re: Re: Question for Sprint-Endurance racers

Remember me?





This pic is actually photographic evidence of Justin's increased patience (or courtesy, or something). He's waving to me in an apparent apology because he passed me close at the entrance to this turn at Baber (the back chicane). I remember thinking that it sure was nice of him to wave, but it was a perfectly clean move...I wouldn't have even noticed it if he hadn't waved.

In any case, thanks for the wave, and it was a perfect pass to boot! :up:

 

Justin Patient? I'm his buddy and he broke off my brake lever in a race this year. I went to wera to get him band and they said he did to much attract homo sexual riders.

 

Yep That is absolutely true he got you over on his side!! Backside that is!!!

 

Well shit Troy, I attracted you to the sport. And then you dumped me for Ben. I guess you like em young looking?

 

Oh, yeah! It's cool to ride out there on an SV, while getting passed by Kevin and Tray! The one thing that got me was getting up close and personal with Tray and his GSXR 1000!

It was all good, Tray got me through the chicane faster than I every had before.......then I saw Jesus!:wow:

 

You should try it the other way around. We ran endurance for three years and no sprint racing. We couldn't afford it compared to our budget so we always went home.

My first sprint race after those three years had me riding like endurance. You see, the times are a bit (and only a bit) slower than sprint racing, but the difference is that you have at least an hour - in our case, we had an hour and a half - to get what you need to do, done.

In a sprint, you got 8 laps. I would ride like I had an hour or so. I wasn't aggressive in turn 1, I wasn't aggressive in overtaking, etc. It took a good half season to get into sprint mode.

If you do both, however, you can change that switch a bit easier as it gets familiar quicker...

 

I was amazed watching Tray fly down the backstretch at TGPR adjust his closing speed to fall in behind our air-cooled Duc (going significantly slower than Tray's typical corner speed at the sweeper) without even upsetting the suspension then making a clean pass w/ horsepower at the corner exit.

 

I was amazed watching Tray fly down the front straight at TGPR adjust his closing speed to fall in behind Gheto Customs SV going significantly slower than Tray's typical corner speed and then dive bombing into him taking 'em both out.......