Lost the “Lifter Lottery”....

Discussion in 'General' started by ChemGuy, Jan 23, 2020.

  1. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!

  2. Rebel635

    Rebel635 Well-Known Member

    Not sure about gen V stuff, but Gen III and Gen iV LS, the 6.2 are rectangular ports while the 5.3/4.8 has cathedral ports....dont bolt up.

  3. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!

    On the Gen V its common to swap the 6.2 manifold and TB. Its bolt on.

    Not sure how much actual power you get but it must be some as several people did it when they do this repair since its all off anyway.
  4. ducnut

    ducnut Well-Known Member

    I’d probably do the Texas Speed and Performance delete kit and Stage 2 low-lift truck cam kit (212/218, .550/.550, 112° lobe), which is worth ~50hp. But, no need to spend Kooks money on headers. TSP have stainless 1-7/8” headers available for mid-$400 range and are worth another ~15hp. You’ll need to have the AFM turned off in your ECM, which is going to be at least $150-$200 (tuner has to buy a credit to unlock the ECM, which is $100 alone). If you don’t have someone local with the capability (like with HP Tuners) and have to send it off, no one better than Horsepower Factory down in Houston.

    My buddy and I ended up with our engines out of our trucks at roughly the same time. He has the TSP delete kit, Stage 4 cam (223/226, .600/.600, 111° lobe), long tubes, 3” single, 4.11 gear, and Jake’s triple disc converter, in prep for an LSA blower. The cam is just way too rowdy and all topend. I went with a Comp Cams 206/212, .515/.522, on a 112° lobe, minor head work, higher compression pistons, manifolds (Chinese shorties kept leaking), 3” single with cats, and 3.73’s. It has a very minor what sounds like a stumble in the idle. It’s an excellent DD cam and the truck howls the tires at a rolling 30mph (32.5” KO2’s). I’d go another level up in cam, like the TSP cam I suggested to you, if doing it again. And, both our ECM’s have tunes in them, his done local and I sent mine off.

    Doing a worthy performance cam, exhaust, and tune will really wake up your truck, with at least 70 more horsepower.
  5. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!


    Did you guys replace oil pumps? Is your or his 4WD? Seems like some people only have 2wd headers. Thanks for the cam info.
  6. ducnut

    ducnut Well-Known Member

    Intakes are worth nothing until you get well into the 600 naturally aspirated horsepower range, which is all above 6000rpm. And, no factory GM intake will help up there. Keep the truck intake.

    It’s the same story with heads, too. Cathedral port make more power everywhere, under 6000rpm. Skip rectangle port heads, as well.

    Richard Holdener has a killer YT channel, with countless back-to-back tests of just about everything. He’s worth checking out, if you’re into LS stuff at all. The guy is an absolute legend, in engine circles.
  7. sdg

    sdg *

    Heads with bronze guides. Valves will be your next problem.
  8. Phl218

    Phl218 Lemme ask my wife

    I ain’t buying another bike with carbs
  9. ducnut

    ducnut Well-Known Member

    He replaced the pickup O-ring, which is the only thing that fails (notoriously) in the oiling system.

    Mine is a complete new engine. The original suffered topend failure. I’m not sure what caused what, but, lifters collapsed, lost a cam lobe, cam bearings spun and disintegrated, and had zero oil at the rockers, while the engine was running. Rather than replace all that stuff and take a chance of debris in the mains, I elected to just replace the whole engine and not destroy new topend bits. The previous engine carried 40+psi, at all times.

    If you’re not familiar with LS oiling, it’s picked up by the pump up at the crank snout, sent through the mains, from the front. Then, it’s diverted through the oil filter, then, up to the cam. From there, it goes up top.

    Edit: We’re both 2WD. Shorty headers are only worth 3-4hp, because the factory manifolds are so good, already.
  10. John Branch

    John Branch The REAL92

    Put a coyote motor in and she we like better:Poke:
    YamahaRick likes this.
  11. RRP

    RRP Kinda Superbikey

    You be quiet...
    Sabre699 likes this.
  12. Phl218

    Phl218 Lemme ask my wife

    Got 2 and a half that annoy me
    RRP likes this.
  13. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!

    Some people recommend replacing the oil pump when you delete since the stock pump is so high volume for the AFM it may be in the long run to run that much volume and pressure.

    I didnt want to pull it bu the more I watch YT videos...i may just pull the mill out. Being 4WD means getting at anything below, oil pan etc is a bigger pain, like lower or pull the diff....


    I dont want to go full on build but damn while your in there....
  14. ducnut

    ducnut Well-Known Member

    I wouldn’t touch the oil pump. “Some people” will lead you down a rabbit hole that’s unnecessary to go down. If the pump was necessary, it’d be an included part of a delete kit. LS specialists that do this stuff all week don’t touch them. I wouldn’t either.

    Here are some tips to make this less painful. Have your A/C system evacuated, before anything. Pull the entire frontend out, before touching the engine. The bumper is like 6 bolts, then, the grille and core support should be some push-in fasteners and like 12 or so bolts. I had that all out of mine in a little over an hour. You want the frontend up on jackstands and front wheels off. That’ll allow you to pull the fender liners, which is like a 10min job. This will allow you to stand right in front of the engine to get to everything. It’ll allow full access to exhaust bolts and accessory drive bolts on the sides. You won’t be having to be bending over the radiator or fenders. If you elect to pull the engine, lift the engine, remove the engine mounts, set the engine down on the crossmember, and this will make it a LOT easier to get to the bellhousing bolts. GM put a body seam right in the way of the bellhousing bolts, making it almost impossible to get to them. There is a coolant plug on the right side of the block, just above the starter. You’ll want to pull that, drain the block, and put it back in, early on. Otherwise, you’ll have a non-stop coolant drip out the lower radiator hose.
    rob linders, ChemGuy and sdg like this.
  15. BSA43

    BSA43 Well-Known Member

    Hearing tales of woe like this make me glad all my trucks are pre-1996 iron head, iron block, pushrod, flat tappet, timing chain, 2 valves per cylinder, gas, TBI SBC V-8s. All I do is replace a ECT sensor (or something equally simple) once in a while and I'm good for another 50k miles.

    Ain't got time for that high-tech crap from GM or anyone else.
    ducnut likes this.
  16. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!

    Yeah. If pulling the motor wasnt such a giant bitch I would do that for sure. But its so mush extra stuff to pull it...

    I need to call some places re the oil pump. Ive always had good pressure so I probably wont do it.

    Its nice to not really have to "do it" ie need the truck asap. So I can pull it apart and make some changes in my plan as I go along.

    Thanks for the advice.
  17. ducnut

    ducnut Well-Known Member

    Pulling it isn’t much more than you’re already doing.
    There’s an under-engine harness that goes to the A/C compressor, crank position sensor, and starter that needs disconnected. Remove torque converter, bellhousing, and engine mount bolts (12 total, I think). Everything else you’d disconnect or remove would be done for pulling the heads, anyway. So, there’s not much more to do.

    If you’re thinking you’re going to pull it, you need to decide early-on. If so, you can leave the exhaust manifolds, valve covers, coil packs, and other minor peripherals on the engine and pull it intact. You’ll need an LS-specific plate that bolts into the engine valley to pull it.

    If you don’t have any broken exhaust manifold bolts, you probably will when you go to remove them. Way easier to deal with that and disassembly on an engine stand.

    For the intake, disconnect the fuel line and wire harness, remove the intake bolts, and take the whole thing off as an assembly. Leave the fuel rails, TB, and everything else intact.

    A bungee cord to hold the upper wire harness to the left hood hinge will be handy.

    My buddy in the auto repair business swaps Silverado engines in 8hrs, so they’re not really that bad. It’s almost as if GM planned for it, when looking at how easy it is.
  18. YoshiHNS

    YoshiHNS Mr. Slowly

    My condolences. Dad's shop truck had the lifter failure at 150k. Guess we were lucky. Decided to replace whole engine with a GM Remanufactured since it came with a 3yr warranty with a dealer install. Don't need to worry about what else was damaged or what else was on its way out. Expensive christmas gift for sure.
  19. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!

    Started disassembly today.

    That effing radiator and fans sucks. Goof hoses and connectors to remove. In about 4 hrs work got rad, fans, alternator, ac compressor and water pump removed.

    Tomorrow is intake, valve covers and heads...I hope.

    Have to order parts and maybe get everything to put it back together next weekend.
    ducnut likes this.
  20. casjoker

    casjoker Refusing middle age

    I cam imagine pulling apart a modern vehicle with all the crap that's on them these days. Long gone are the days of being able to crawl right inside the engine compartment. Good Luck Chemguy hope it goes as smoothly as possible.

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