I need a new handgun...lets talk guns today. :D

Discussion in 'General' started by Kris87, Mar 17, 2010.

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  1. dobr24

    dobr24 Well-Known Member

  2. Tristan

    Tristan Well-Known Member

  3. redtailracing

    redtailracing gone tuna fishin'

    Because of versatility? I literally cannot think of a single thing that a 9 can do that a 5.56 cannot. But there is plenty that the 9 cannot do. Unless you're just a diehard AR guy and are far more efficient with AR controls, I see no reason for an AR-9. If you want a sub gun, then I'd suggest just buying a dedicated sub gun, not trying to make a rifle something it was never intended to be.
     
    sbk1198 likes this.
  4. Tristan

    Tristan Well-Known Member

    I don't know what I don't know... just looking at the ammo I'm guessing the rifle rounds penetrate further and are more accurate at longer distances. And they cost twice as much. Beyond that... I know squat
     
  5. shakazulu12

    shakazulu12 Well-Known Member

    Plinking, gaming, lower cost, quieter both suppressed or otherwise, and ability to shoot at pistol ranges and expected use sub 100 yards = Edge to AR9

    Significantly more damage to things made of meat and bone, longer distance shooting, competing in 3 gun or practical rifle specifically = Edge to .223/5.56

    Life is short, buy both.
     
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  6. redtailracing

    redtailracing gone tuna fishin'

    Yea, 5.56 is going to work far better in regards to ballistics and penetration with a negligible difference in recoil. And yes 5.56 is more expensive than 9mm but still possibly the cheapest centerfire rifle cartridge you can buy.

    While I don’t have any experience with this, I have read that AR-9s also don’t always cycle as reliably as dedicated sub guns. But again, hearsay as I’ve never played with one. If you want a compact 9mm, like I said before buy a dedicated sub gun, like a stribog or sig mpx.
     
  7. Tristan

    Tristan Well-Known Member

    Thanks guys. How do the 2 rounds differ in a defense situation as far as causing unwanted damage after exiting the perp? Talking hollowpoint 9mm vs. 223/556
     
  8. SpeedyE

    SpeedyE Experimental prototype, never meant for production

    hahahaha:crackup:
     
  9. shakazulu12

    shakazulu12 Well-Known Member

    .223/5.56 over 9mm in a landslide for all things putting people down without going through multiple barriers in the process. Assuming appropriate bullet selection. Not even close in that regards. It's a common misconception that it will penetrate through several walls as opposed to pistol ammunition, but reality is the opposite. Only real negative in that situation is the potential for permanent hearing damage if used indoors.

    But this also depends on the zombie/crackhead scenario you are envisioning. Odds of having to use your gun to protect yourself or family are slim. Odds that the potential threat will continue advancing while being shot at are even slimmer. YMMV.
     
    dobr24 likes this.
  10. dobr24

    dobr24 Well-Known Member

    I have both. 9mm is so much fun to shoot and the mags are compatible with a lot of my handguns. .223/556 is the real rifle round comparatively speaking.

    Don't forget 7.62x39 in the AR platform. Cheaper than the .223 and 556 but still a true rifle round.

    So many choices.
     
  11. sbk1198

    sbk1198 Well-Known Member

    I agree with the previous several posts. 5.56 all the way! The cost is not that much higher. I buy ammo in bulk, and the 9mm is usually around 22 cents a round give or take (yes there is cheaper if you get the steel cased stuff like Tulamo or Wolf, but I don't buy that), and 5.56 ammo around 30-35 cents a round. Anything above 100 yards, the 9mm will be useless. Accuracy will suck. 5.56 you can shoot pretty damn accurately to about 600 yards or even farther if you get match grade ammo and have a good AR. Penetration depends mostly on the type of each ammo. 5.56 M193 is a softer bullet which gets smashed when it hits the target and will tear some shit up but won't penetrate much. Perfect for self defense situations. M855 (green tip) is a penetrating round so it would make a nice clean hole but go through a bunch of stuff. Likewise with 9mm you have regular ball ammo, FMJ which is the common stuff people use for target practice, and then you have hollow point ammo which doesn't penetrate for shit but will tear some shit up real good!

    Check with your range too because not all ranges allow AR pistols on the pistol range. My range for example does not. They basically say that if it looks like an AR or another type of rifle then it's not a pistol and doesn't belong on the pistol range.

    The best solution is naturally to have both! :D Get you an MP5 replica in 9mm and then get a nice AR chambered in 5.56. There is also the 7.62x39 option as mentioned above. That's even cheaper than 5.56. Or if you want to just have an AR that you can fire a few rounds when someone breaks into your house and it doesn't even matter if you hit them or not, they will scatter like rats just because of the noise and the pressure release from the muzzle, get yourself a Falkor Petra AR...chambered in 300 Win Mag! :D Although you might hit your neighbor's house with it...and the house after it lol
     
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  12. redtailracing

    redtailracing gone tuna fishin'

    5.56 is far more devastating against flesh and there are far more options in types of ammo from what I’ve seen. And oddly enough, it does not necessarily overpenetrate worse than 9. I believe this has a lot to do with mass. The 5.56 is generally almost half the weight of 9mm and breaks up easier. Frangible 5.56 is where it’s at for home defense between the two. If you ever had to use it in self defense a surgeon would likely call afterwards to cuss you out. But the big bonus is it’ll damn near disintegrate in dry wall.

    And then if you really wanna go down the rabbit hole, there’s .300AAC blackout. But that’s a whole different mess. It’s what I use but I’d suggest something simpler for your first AR.
     
  13. sbk1198

    sbk1198 Well-Known Member

    Surgeons perform autopsies? I thought they had other people for that...
     
  14. DmanSlam

    DmanSlam Well-Known Member

    As someone mentioned, and I discovered while wearing only headphones, 5.56 weapons are loud enough to cause hearing loss (ringing) and possibly, a concussion. So, fyi.
     
  15. redtailracing

    redtailracing gone tuna fishin'

    Assuming he makes it long enough for someone to try and save him :crackup:
     
    sbk1198 likes this.
  16. redtailracing

    redtailracing gone tuna fishin'

    Meh, I’ve shot both without ear pro on. Both are so far in the direction of hearing loss I don’t think it matters. And hearing loss is the last thing I’m worried about in home defense but if you are worried about it, there are more options for running suppressed subsonic 5.56 to my knowledge. Those things are insanely quiet.
     
  17. DmanSlam

    DmanSlam Well-Known Member

    I realize donning hearing protection in a home defense situation isn't the first thing I will probably do. I remember standing behind my friend as he fired his 5.56 rifle and feeling the loud blast. I'm a gun noob. So take my input for what it's (probably not) worth!
     
  18. redtailracing

    redtailracing gone tuna fishin'

    Haha no worries man. Just pointing that shooting any centerfire cartridge unsuppressed is the fucking suck. You’re just talking about varying levels of suck at that point.
     
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  19. sbk1198

    sbk1198 Well-Known Member

    This is why I think my go-to would be the shotgun in a situation like that. It's also loud as fuck, but at least I know I'll only have to shoot it once (assuming just one individual is breaking in). Whereas with a pistol or AR, which are also loud as fuck, I would probably have the tendency to shoot multiple times. I've already made the mistake of not having my ear muffs on one of my ears when I shot my 6.5 creedmoor RPR, and that was insanely loud! I've never in my life experienced anything that loud before. I seriously thought I lost hearing in my left ear after that.
     
  20. sanee

    sanee Well-Known Member

    im not sure what you have but if this is your first ar dont get a pistol. Looks "tacticool" but its not that fun to shot as its loud and a handful. Get a 16 inch barrel or a 14.5 with a pinned break and you will love shooting it wayyyy more.
     

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