Getting A/B bike setup the same - what am I missing?

I've put some time and a little bit of money to get my A bike to match my B bike.

The things I'm trying to address:
1) cornering - the A bike just feels "taller" and a tad slower on turn-in
2) acceleration - the A bike's suspension "feels like" it has a bit more vertical movement (but the OEM seat doesn't hold me in one place either)
3) ride height (it bugs me that the bikes don't "sit" the same)

Some obvious differences between the bikes:

- rear shock: A bike has penske double-clicker; B bike has an OEM with upgraded spring
- throttle: A bike has stock throttle; B bike has motion pro rev 2 (I have a second rev 2 for the A bike to install)
- tires: Both use same OEM on both (but I switch off between slicks and DOT streets); I stick to the same brand/model tires
- brakes: A has brembo; B has oem (both have braded lines and same brembo rc19 lever/master cylinder)
- chain/sprockets: Both have same gearing (oem front, same vortex model on rear) but the B bike has one less link so, yes, its wheelbase is a bit shorter.
- steering; Both same bearings (which operate smoothly) and clip-ons but I actually noticed the A bike's clip-ons are about 1/2" farther outside of their clamps.
- fairings/seat: A bike has Sharkskinz and uses OEM seat; B bike has hotbodies and uses a custom cut superbike seat (much thinner and different-shaped profile).

Either way, the B bike always feels better OR maybe I just have greater confidence on it since it was my primary bike at first, I track it a lot. And the A bike just serves race duty (unless it is raining).

After writing all this, I see I need to farkle up the A bike more.

Everything else is the same or doesn't factor into my concerns (I think) like my front suspension: same tubes and matching internals. No issues there.

I need to re-measure the ride height. feels different, noticeably I might add. But height measurement-wise, they're the same.

What am I overlooking?

 

This post makes no sense….

Your looking for an explanation why two motorcycles that have different components of different build qualities, measurements, wear etc don’t handle the same?

I don’t understand how this isn’t self explanatory?

 

I absolutely hate the MP throttle... its like a light switch to me. R6 throttle tube works best for me on that vintage 1k.
OEM tires?? Like from 2005?
like @JBowen33 said... you cant get the same feel with different components/setups. This is where precision comes in.

 

@JBowen33 , writing as a stream of consciousness has great benefits. If you get it, you get it.

Agreeing in part because, yes, as I wrote it out, most of it becomes self-explanatory. But making two bikes look the same does not make them feel the same.

So, looking for shifts and insights here.

 

True. I am hoping that some components more than others will factor into the "same feel" and maybe not spend money on things that don't matter for what I'm addressing.

 

What do the bikes looking the same have anything to do with what you are asking? Also what am I “not getting”?

Your bikes are not the same as you described them as they have different parts and vastly different quality of said parts, therefore they are different and by default your answering your own question as to why they “feel” different because well…. they are.


If you want them to feel the same you need to have the same components.

 

Take both bikes to a track weekend... swap components back & forth? First off the OEM shock with heavier spring is not doing you any favors on a closed course, especially under acceleration.
After a few laps in 90 degree heat my stock shock reacted like a strut and the tire did not like it. Just swapping OEM wheels to Marchesinis makes the bike feel dramatically different.
I would ask how the slipper is setup? The way my bikes are setup... downshifts are drama free & it free wheels like a 2 stroke.

How close are you able to do consistent laps on both? I would worry about the primary bike. If you bin it then take what components you can to put on the B unit.
Seems like having a B bike is more of a luxury than necessity.

 

This. Your b bike is a heck of a lot different than your a bike and I’d use it as a stated above, a back up rolling chassis. If you are worried about it get to know b bike better in case you need to ride it as is as a back up. Go test and swap components as not every frame / chassis is exactly the same, etc.
issue I see is things that made a pretty big difference in feel as different so adjust accordingly.

 

What I was hoping to seek was input that, given all the differences I mentioned, were there a few, small changes that would contribute to what I listed as things I'm addressing. Maybe so I can focus my time and money where it will have the most impact. I don't believe that everything I listed would have an impact.

You're right. I did notice, for the gsxr600 06 (B bike) and 07 (A bike) the frames and swingarm have subtle differences.

So, along with @TurboBlew 's comments, I agree that I need track the A bike more so I get to know it. First thing that's gonna go is that vinyl oem seat. The B bike (and when you see it, you'll know why. Haha) is so familiar, I just prefer it.

 

Go with what bothers you about the different feel first. What about front forks? Geometry? Even if stock (in”think” they are same forks but too lazy to verify) but one set could be fresh while other not. Not to mention springs etc. As a start is sag even the same on the front? What’s the delta on rear with two shocks not to mention you have a different wheelbase. Those are just a few variables but they all add up to things like turning,
Based on the few details you have here your a bike should have less “feel” and be slower on turn in.
For me in the past trying to get a b bike that’s a true back up and in case of emergency bike knowing it doesn’t have the same suspension as a bike I try to get that bike as close to the a bike as possible with things that are important to me.
this is just my preference:
A- throttle tubes being same throw is a must (just one of those picky items for me and it’s cheap relatively speaking)
B- geometry - since suspension is different the geometry could be a bit different to get the bikes to behave the same because of a lot of variables I.e. way fork valving behaves as just one of many many variables. Simple things like ensuring same fluid (fresh to ensure apples to apples ) at same oil level height, rear shock length (shims, adjustments, etc), get them to same wheel base. You have so many variables directly influencing what “feel” issues you are having you spelled them out to yourself. Sag numbers are a starting point for me (and most), there are “ranges” that should be adhered to in general but end of the day things like track, your riding style, etc have a massive influence. Look at a lot of teams with two riders almost equal pace wise and their set ups could be night and day. If you ever happen to meet Aaron Yates as him about rear sag The guy ran rear springs that were crazy but worked for his style.

All these things can be addressed to get the bikes as close as possible by allotting money (and time) to a good suspension tuner to work with you. Not doing that you could piss away 5-10x that amount in wasting track time, shagging tires, “confidence” crashes, etc. A good tuner will get them as close as they can be but you cannot expect them to be the same, especially when that stock shock heats up and goes to shit.

C- if not an a is the seat. An Oem seat and a sbk tail will feel way different as a huge part of the feel of a bike is through your ass cheeks. Will more of a direct link to the bike with a sbk tail you feel more connected.

summary- swap out what you can, get them close as you can with obvious stuff, get a suspension tuner or same suspension and geometry set up to start with.

 

Man, this is what I needed to hear. Some techie data points that challenge what I know and am being stubborn about (spending money) or am being too lazy to figure out right now on my own (spending more time). For your "C" answer, I just came to that realization last night after wondering why the ride height, from where I measured, was the same on both. Seat height is different. Anyway, looking at rear shocks online now. I'll be making some changes and then taking both bikes over to the shop to have their suspensions baselined.

Thanks.

 

@TurboBlew , you are absolutely right. While looking for a few major bike components, I found a ready-to-ride "spare" bike. And, as someone on the beeb said: The best spare parts bin is another matching bike.

 

That chain length difference is a huge contributing factor. The swingarm length difference also affects rear ride height… so the ride heights aren’t the same. This suggests the shocks are even more different than you think.

 

That is a real interesting point to consider (about the shocks) and gets my thinking out of the box. Possibly one I might not have discovered till after I replaced the rear shock and adjusted the chains. Gonna measure the shock lengths out of my own curiosity.

 

Exactly.

 

Uh… you wanna double check those years?

 

No. I'm good.

 

There shouldn’t be a difference.