Did you pay the heated seats bill?

Discussion in 'General' started by BigBird, Nov 22, 2021.

  1. motoracer1100

    motoracer1100 Well-Known Member

    Yep .. if your talking 1:24 scale , made of plastic that you glue together and place on a shelf :D
  2. SGVRider

    SGVRider Well-Known Member

    How do they know? The only possible way is if you take it in for service at an authorized dealer or if they have some kind of over the air update system that also tattles on you. Over the air update probably wouldn’t be too cumbersome to disable, maybe just literally unplug the antenna lol. Forever avoiding the dealership might be much harder.

    As far as I know all of the whizbangery outside the engine is controlled by different computers not the ECU. I’d expect those would be less secure.

    Also, this subscription model only makes sense if the cost of including the extra components is less than the expected value on simplified logistics and the subscription returns. So I’m sure they’ll try this with some features but not others.

    This stuff could definitely be hacked, but it’s going to be a pain in the ass for sure.

    Also, this will royally piss people off. I’d expect some legislation to come down the pike. Maybe “features must be available for purchase at no greater than the 3 year equivalent of the subscription price.”

    If they can force this model on us it’s just another way for them to bloat cars with features we don’t need by creating an additional financing model. You can’t really get a decent new car under $30k these days, it’s totally out of control. Even a decent used one is still stupid money.

    Just looked up the numbers, average used car sale price is 26500, new is 41000. :crackup:

    Used to be less than 20 years ago you could buy an okay house in Texas and other places for 50. Some places you can still pay 100-150. Compare that to new car prices and you see how out of control it is.
  3. BigBird

    BigBird blah

    Not sure if you're talking subscription or tune on the ECU. For tune, any drivetrain warranty work, the pull the ECU tables and there is a TD code that goes from 0 to 1, and just continues to add to the counter when you add a tune, overwrite the ECU, etc. No one has been able a way to figure out to reliably reset that counter to 0. Some have done it, but then it doesn't line up with other code, and VAG detects that.

    They also look at boost logs, etc., and see how those parameters are in comparison to stock.
  4. SuddenBraking

    SuddenBraking The Iron Price

    These features will almost certainly not be hack-able in the future.

    I don't think there's going to be much appetite in the US for the government telling private companies how they should price their services.
  5. SGVRider

    SGVRider Well-Known Member

    Everything is hackable if you’re willing to expend the resources and effort. Hackability exists relative to money and will. The iPhone can still be jailbroken all these years later and is thoroughly penetrated by US and probably other intelligence agencies. The security goal for feature protection will be to make it difficult and expensive enough to dissuade all but the most determined and skilled users. Some will still manage, if for shits and giggles if nothing else.

    The automobile market is already extremely regulated. With everything from exactly what safety features, emissions, and mileage standards a vehicle has to meet to the maximum rate of usury they can charge for financing. They even specify how a car manufacturer can distribute their products. Specifying that subscription services must be available for purchase outright at some function of their monthly pricing comports fine with the already established regulatory regime.
  6. SGVRider

    SGVRider Well-Known Member

    Oh yeah if you give them access it’s going to be nigh on impossible to hide assuming they look. They can’t get access unless you let it connect to Wi-Fi or take it to a dealer though. I think the avoiding the dealer thing for the life of the vehicle will actually be a lot harder than any hacking. I mean there are ways you could just load the unmodified data and application before taking it in, but now it’s getting into the “just pay for it” zone.
  7. auminer

    auminer Renaissance Redneck

    Here I'm wondering if my 2003 F150 will make 20 more years.

    By then I'll be ready to drive it to the assisted living facility & give it to whichever nurse is cutest.

    EDIT: or whichever one pisses me off the most, as the case may be.
    beac83 likes this.
  8. SuddenBraking

    SuddenBraking The Iron Price

  9. Venom51

    Venom51 John Deere Equipment Expert - Not really

    crashman likes this.
  10. nigel smith

    nigel smith Well-Known Member

    The answer is yes. My F150 is 43 years old and I would drive it anywhere, except for the 9mpg thing.
    auminer likes this.
  11. Montoya

    Montoya Well-Known Member

    Shrugs, no idea how this plays out, but I certainly see some variation of this in the future…

    Automakers: “Just so you know, we red flag every vehicle that’s had its security features hacked. We can no longer trust the integrity of the collision avoidance, emergency braking, lane assist, lidar and vision systems, etc”.

    Insurance Companies: “…that really raises the risk profiles!”

    Bankers: “Did we calculate this into our rates? There’s new risk factors!”

    Automakers: “…the only people probably doing this are also hackers and probably people who like speed, performance, …high risk!”

    Insurance Companies & Bankers: “Hmm… we need to put these into our risk models.”

    Automakers: “They also probably bypassed emissions…!”

    Insurance Companies: “Gasp… can we just state that modifying security settings, voids our policies?”

    Automakers: “Evil nods…”
  12. joec

    joec brace yourself

    I don't want a subscription to anything else..seriously.
  13. TWF2

    TWF2 2 heads are better than 1

    I hear Tesla won't give you auto driver if you speed or don't drive like old lady :)
    Phl218 likes this.
  14. Sabre699

    Sabre699 Wait...hold my beer.

    Soooo...another win for the bottom feeders ??
    SGVRider and motoracer1100 like this.
  15. crashman

    crashman Grumpy old man

    Even the MPG thing is a non starter for me. If I replaced my 12MPG Jeep with a new vehicle that got 36MPG and cost $50K I would have to drive approx. 160k miles just to break even at $5 per gallon. And any new vehicle I like is more than $50k, doesn't get 36MPG and gas where I live is still under $3/gallon. For the amount I drive it just does not pencil out.
  16. SGVRider

    SGVRider Well-Known Member

    This actually makes a shitload of sense. Even to stick it to the man, I wouldn’t risk not being covered in an accident.
  17. motoracer1100

    motoracer1100 Well-Known Member

    Sounds like you need to drive faster and rev it up at stop lights to get the numbers to work out for you to save money .. :D
    Gorilla George likes this.
  18. SGVRider

    SGVRider Well-Known Member

    That’s what’s great about being a bottom feeder. No matter who wins and what battles are fought above you, you always get some tasty scraps that float down. It’s not a glamorous living, but it’s a solid one. Cockroaches have been around for hundreds of millions of years, and will be around long after the hairless ape things nuke eachother into extinction.
  19. SuddenBraking

    SuddenBraking The Iron Price

  20. Ducati89

    Ducati89 Ticketing Melka's dirtybike

    Ahhhh....so much for that free plug in power at Wawa.....

    Welcome back to the future.

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