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Honda rancher conundrum....

Discussion in 'General' started by tzrider, May 11, 2022.

  1. tzrider

    tzrider CZrider

    The engine runs fine for about 3-4 minutes (depending on how it is used) and then dies. Fuel starvation.(obligatory backfire once in a while). And yes, the spark is healthy (and yes, there is fuel in the tank).
    If you try to start right ahead, no go.
    The longer you wait, the longer it runs.
    Sounds like the classic partly blocked fuel filter, dunnit?

    Except it's fuel injected and the filter is within the fuel pump apparatus.

    So these pumps always come within their own reservoir to deal with sloshing. So it is (one would think) emptying that and running out of fuel. Except there's no blockage into the reservoir.

    I ordered a fuel filter kit but I have my doubt that this will fix anything.

    Any expert on Honda TRX420 2017 here that may have come across something similar?....

    TIA
     
  2. evakat

    evakat Well-Known Member

    Can't you disconnect the fuel line and add a temp line/fuel can above the Rancher to create a "gravity fed " fuel system as a test?
     
  3. G 97

    G 97 Garth

    Hmmmmm, no idea. I got my Dad a new 2005 Honda Foreman trx500 FM. Used almost daily, marginally abused and a little lax on regular maintenance. The damn thing has been bullet proof. Pretty amazing.
     
  4. fastfreddie

    fastfreddie Midnight Oil Garage

    Blocked tank vent?
     
    stickboy274 and Big T like this.
  5. tzrider

    tzrider CZrider

    No, it's fuel injected.
     
  6. Evad101

    Evad101 Well-Known Member

    My dad has a 2012 that does something similar but only when it gets hot. He researched and found it was the fuel pump cutting out. Has a new one but we have not yet changed it out.
     
  7. tzrider

    tzrider CZrider

    That one I have to check, I just thought it was too quick for a vent but it's a very good point. I'll leave the cap off.
     
  8. jimmyboost

    jimmyboost one buck a boom

    2nd on the tank vent. We had an SV endurance bike that would act the same way and it was a partially blocked check valve.
     
  9. 10MM

    10MM Action Reaction

    I’m not sure the range but there is a recall for TRX fuel pumps. Call your local dealer with the VIN to check.

    most likely failing fuel pump. If you can connect an in-line analog gauge and monitor as ATV is acting up
     
  10. 10MM

    10MM Action Reaction

    Min fuel pressure 40-42 psi
     
  11. tzrider

    tzrider CZrider

    I was at the dealer and he mentioned that.

    Apparently from 2018 and I can't remember the cutoff year (2020?)

    Up to now it's the most likely issue. He's seeing if he can find a jobber pump.

    Where I used to work we had in-line pressure gauge that connected directly to the clip-on outlet.

    But thanks for the input!

    .....oh, and it wasn't the vent.
     
  12. peakpowersports

    peakpowersports Well-Known Member

    Does it also die if your in the gas? Like say start it and ride it wide open will it still shut down?
     
  13. borislav

    borislav Well-Known Member

    Fuel pump relay, swap it with similar relay from PDC box.
    This is easy and simple step in process of elimination in diagnostics!
     
  14. tzrider

    tzrider CZrider

    Oh yeah, tried that! Fucker still dies but really backfires... :D

    That is a good point. That being said, when I shut down and turn on again, the fuel pump goes through its cycle. I'll try nonetheless, Thx!

    BTW, the fuel tank is/was clean. The amber coloured fuel gave some impression of crud at the bottom and I siphoned it out, but beyond the few specs here & there, it was as clean as a bucket of ice cream in a pregnant woman's hands....
     
  15. ducnut

    ducnut Well-Known Member

    Be sure and install a new NGK plug, from your dealer, before moving forward. The backfiring makes me question a lack of fuel and has me wondering more about a failing plug, because you wouldn’t have fuel for the backfire, if there’s no fuel being injected. Working in a Honda dealer, a failing plug was the biggest issue with any of their ATV’s. Simply screw in a new plug and they’d be fixed.

    I say to buy the plug from your dealer, because of all the counterfeit NGK stuff floating around.
     
  16. Once a Wanker..

    Once a Wanker.. Always a Wanker!

    Is a 'Honda Rancher conundrum....' something from Brokeback Mountain?

    I never watched it.
     
    G 97 likes this.
  17. JBall

    JBall REALLY senior member

    Rode an R6 endurance bike that did this exactly. There was a fuel filter internal to the fuel pump. In the shop manual it would show that the whole fuel pump needed to be replaced, but is could actually be taken apart to clean the internal filter. Ran fine after that, but drove us crazy because it would run fine for a few laps and then slow down. After it sat a few minutes, the internal reservoir would refill and it was good as new for a few minutes.
     
    cav115 likes this.
  18. tgold

    tgold Well-Known Member

    Is it an actual backfire or afterfire? A backfire is when the intake valve is open and fuel burning in the intake s When it happens it can blow the airbox off. An afterfire is when unburnt fuel catches fire in the exhaust system.
     
  19. Motofun352

    Motofun352 Well-Known Member

    Run it with the gas cap off to verify it's not the tank vent...or pull the cap immediately after it craps out and listen for a woosh and an immediate restart. Do the cheap things first.
     
    evakat likes this.
  20. tzrider

    tzrider CZrider

    Hard to tell the difference between the two, I'm going with 'afterfire' simply because there is no timing issue, the bike runs perfectly, until it doesn't. Airbox is clean, no blow backs.


    I tried with vent disconnected and cap off for good measure, same outcome. I will try to listen more carefully to the pump as it shuts down but it isn't that obvious with the noise. I really wish I could easily put a pressure gauge...

    For now since the fuel pump module is all disassembled, I ordered a jobber pump instead of the whole OEM ass'y. We'll see...

    Thx for all the feedback.
     

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