The Vietnam War. On PBS by Ken Burns?

10 part series. 18 hours total. Very good first part last night.

 

Saw it last night. Very well done so far.

 

I watched part 1, and plan to watch the rest. I have to say, as a (very amateurish) history buff, I could follow along just fine. However, my 10th grader and wife had trouble with all the jumping around, and in fact it does come across as a bit disjointed. They're building up the background (middle 1800s with the French), but want to avoid losing folks so they keep coming back to the 1960's when America joined in the fun, then WW1, and WW2, then Korean War, then b/w wars, etc.

One thing I learned long ago, and this series will only serve to confirm it: "screw the french"!

 

Lafayette was okay for a Frenchie.

 

The Vietnam issue actually goes back to 1945. Roosevelt had promised Ho Chi Min that the US would stand behind his elected position so he aided us during WWII. Then when Roosevelt died and Truman became President he dropped a turd on Ho Chi Min and aided the French. Ho, being pissed, kicked the living shit out of the French and they surrendered in 1954. We got involved about that time and in 1965 Johnson really got us into it.

 

Don't let JFK get off easy either. After several "losses" to the Ruskies he was anxious to draw the line...Viet Nam was his choice. Didn't matter that the South VN was corrupt, it was just a back water anyways.

 

Um, JFK got us in vn. Johnson got us in deeper but it's on JFK.

 

I like Ken Burns' work but I agree, sometimes it's hard to follow. His NYC, and Early Irish in America were awesome but a little hard to follow.

 

Damn Democrat warmongers.

 

JFK came along after Eisenhower. He was the one that sent people to Vietnam in the fifties.

 

Truman dumped Ho and that was the beginning

 

Eisenhower deployed very limited assets in very limited roles. Kennedy, a very strong proponent of special forces and credited along with col aaron banks as actually creating the formal us special forces, literally tripled us forces, committing the us to a ground campaign.

 

One thing that is apparent, up through episode 3, is that each administration wanted to do things "without telling the American public" because they knew their was no support. American leaders, using American tax dollars and American advisors, then American lives, all progressively escalating the conflict while lying to the public about reality.

We absolutely bombed the crap out of that country, and it was woefully insufficient at achieving success. Should serve as a good reminder for how overly optimistic we should be towards NK in the current situation...

 

Not sure I can agree with that statement. VN in terms of infrastructure, agriculture, etc is a very very different proposition than NK. Believe me, as somebody who stood on the DMZ I don't want war. However, tactics and subsequent effectiveness would be just as dissimilar between VN and NK as it was between WWII and VN.

 

That may well be, but we should take our lessons from wherever they may come. "Overconfidence and arrogance", from episode 4, are in equal measure the lessons...

 

Sorry - I see it differently. Inappropriately relating tactics and impact can also lead to negative results.

 

Just how brainwashed is the NK population? From my perspective I would think that they would jump at the chance to get out from underneath this modern version of Caligula. But then I don't really have a clue as to how they actually think. Once "Rocket man" is dealt with, what then? Who steps in to govern that cess pool and will it be better or even worse? These are the real lessons from VN that need to be learned in order to deal with NK.

 

Funny thing about countries rules by totally irrational dictators. Most people that really push thinking for themselves or in any way present a potential threat to the leader tend to wake up dead.

 

I get that, still most people are still rational even if they have to put on an act for the fearless leader. Underneath the facade they got to be wondering just what the hell is going on. The key is can they form a conspiracy without exposing themselves or is KIS's grip so tight that even that is impossible. I fantasize that half of his generals would love to put a bullet in his head if only they could get away with it. I guess KIS understands this as well.