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The Formula One Thread

Discussion in 'General' started by HPPT, Jan 16, 2014.

  1. HPPT

    HPPT !!!

    It is to warn cars behind that the driver is in fuel saving mode. The difference in speed between a car saving fuel and a car at full power with DRS open can be over 40 km/h.
     
  2. Crybaby™

    Crybaby™ Well-Known Member

    Found this

    BBC F1 commentary box producer Tony Dodgins: "Here in testing, the cars have various warning lights on them. All have a flashing red light on the back of the car. This is a torque-reduction warning light. Basically, in the past, before a driver lifted off, he'd check his mirrors (well, usually) but with the torque distributor deciding where it is going to get the power from (engine, Ers, etc) various fuel-saving strategies could mean a car slowing down, say on the straight, other than simply via a throttle/torque map.

    "Therefore, they are experimenting with warning lights to warn following cars whenever there is a torque reduction. The flashing green light on the back of Marcus Ericsson's Caterham, meanwhile, signifies a rookie driver not yet in possession of a superlicence (although it is a formality). Not to be confused with the green light on top of the roll hoop, which signifies to pit crew/marshals that a car is Ers-safe at that time and they can touch it."

    So yeah the sitting duck light seems like a good description
     
  3. BigBird

    BigBird blah

    don't like the sound...wait til the GP bikes are all electric
     
  4. quikie

    quikie Fugitive at Large

    I'm sure we'll get used to it but yeah... they don't sound that great.

    Regarding the fuel flow regulations... I'm confused, it seems like the FIA can just dictate to a team that they adjust their fuel flow and slow / speed a car down.

    Why not just limit the total amount of fuel (like last year) and be done with it. How or when the team uses a fuel map is up to them but ultimately the car would have to be so-and-so efficient to get the entire race done with the initial fuel load. Easy-peasy, right? Or am I missing something?
     
  5. Crybaby™

    Crybaby™ Well-Known Member

    Just change your thinking from when the best sound being when the car is a full bore and flying by. The grunt noise is different, but the sound under decel and braking seems pretty cool. Electrical, Tie Fighter, Syfi sounding are all terms I've heard to describe it. The in car camera under these conditions is pretty interesting to listen to now.

    As for the previous statement about hearing tires more, especially leaving the pits. I noticed the high pitch squeal, more like a normal car tire, but figured it was more from the new compound rather than quieter engine.
     
  6. Crybaby™

    Crybaby™ Well-Known Member

    I originally thought, yeah they limit total fuel used and why limit anything else, but changed a little on that. One of the knobs they have is the fuel trim and they have in the past adjusted it as needed to save fuel, so I think RBR had a tool to reduce fuel flow on the fly, but chose not to use it, even when instructed by F1 to do so.

    As for the reason instantaneous flow should also be limited is probably for competition and maybe safety sake. Early in the race you could get cars that are significantly faster than one another, while they are still very close. Maybe the slower car overall is aided by fuel and power boost to keep others behind him and stack up the field. Then after the race settles down and he's ruined other strategies, he turns the fuel back down and cruises the rest of the way.

    I don't know if that is the real reason for it, or if I agree, but possible and understandable why they might want to limit that too.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2014
  7. DrA5

    DrA5 The OTHER Great Dane

    Thanks for the light info. I also did see the flashing lights on the roll hoop to indicate good touch vs bad touch.
     
  8. Steeltoe

    Steeltoe What's my move?

    Crazy race. Happy for Nico. Guess Vettel and LH had time to go for beers.
     
  9. Jed

    Jed mellifluous

    Question -- if you are limited to 100kg of fuel, why have regulations on fuel flow?

    Push as much fuel as you want, if you run out too bad. Seems silly to regulate flow when you can't refuel.
     
  10. Steeltoe

    Steeltoe What's my move?

    Claire Williams.
    Would ya?
     
  11. Jed

    Jed mellifluous

    Does it bestow boy toy status with the financial perks? If so, sure, if not mebe.
     
  12. Razr

    Razr Well-Known Member

    Soitenly
     
  13. Al-

    Al- Well-Known Member

    its because the point of this whole exercise is to force innovation on fuel efficiency, not just to figure out ways to pile as much boost and fuel into the engine and make power. The fuel restriction is the same thing as if they'd put in an intake restrictor.
     
  14. HPPT

    HPPT !!!

    I did not know about the fuel flow until this weekend, but I'm thinking it might also have something to do with ensuring power-output parity between engines.
     
  15. NemesisR6

    NemesisR6 Gristle McThornbody

    I think somebody mentioned it earlier, but I believe the flow RATE restriction is to prevent teams from having too much disparity in speed at different points during the race, i.e. using more fuel earlier in the race to make passes (in addition to the ERS/DRS capabilities) or to make late charges. Hence the reason they already have the warning "brake light" to signify drivers that are using an alternate fuel map that may see them down on power compared to a driver who isn't conserving fuel.

    The flow rate is a safety measure, nothing more.

    *edit* damn Papa beat me to it.
     
  16. quikie

    quikie Fugitive at Large

    Bullshit. I thought the goal of multi-engine supplier racing was to develop different motors and allow for competition. As for how much fuel they want to use at any point, you could hear the pits radio'ing to change fuel mapping so they obviously still have leeway. Fuel management is strategy, if someone want to use more fuel early on or later on, LET THEM!

    They still have 100 kg fuel total so who cares whether they use it earlier or later in the race.

    As for someone deciding to use it up early and pull a lead, so what? If that strategy works then others will adopt it too.

    If they're trying to make it more equal for safety then why allow the backmarker teams to languish off the pace? That's got to be more unsafe than relatively competitive cars deciding to get a minimal boost by using more fuel earlier in the race rather than later.

    To me it's just st00pid meddling by the FIA. It is quite possibly one of the most idiotic regulations in motorsports.
     
  17. Jed

    Jed mellifluous

    But doesn't the fuel limit act as a defacto fuel flow limiter? Each team has a finite resource they must manage for race distance. If you limit the fuel flow then why limit the amount of fuel on board?

    Both act to ensure efficiency, but why not allow a team to have a map to burn at a high rate if they choose too at a risk of running out of fuel?

    Seems like a silly rule to me.
     
  18. HPPT

    HPPT !!!

    I would imagine that King Bernie is not too keen on putting on a show where the cars have to retire because they run out of fuel. That wouldn't fly with the public for too long.

    By the way, I wasn't saying this whole thing makes sense to me. Just that my statement would be my own guess on why they did this. Or at least one of the reasons.
     
  19. Jed

    Jed mellifluous

    "Look at us we're F1! The model of efficiency and economy for all the world. Hop in your mega yacht, long range jet, armored car, etc. and join us all around the world while we demonstrate how to efficiently burn hundreds of milllllions of dollars all to boost our egos!!!!"

    Yeah I don't buy the fuel efficiency argument for F1.
     
  20. NemesisR6

    NemesisR6 Gristle McThornbody

    You know what, I recant my assumption that is is due to safety......did some more digging.

    "The new rule has been drafted into the technical regulations as the FIA looks to make Formula One more fuel efficient. In 2013, there was no race fuel limit or fuel flow limit, and cars used approximately 160kg of fuel per race at a flow of 170kg an hour."

    So last year there was no flow limit, and cars still had a finite amount of fuel each race. This year they have 30% less fuel.

    I therefore assume my right to use the Chewbacca defense and claim that the rule does not make sense.
     

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