Serial Season 2: Bowe Bergdahl

Yeah. I think he believed they wouldn't look far. Everything in the interviews makes me believe he never thought he'd get caught or that he be gone more than a few hours. He didn't even take much water or MREs with him.

 

Dart,
Were you ever in the military? Do you have any family members in? Do you have any IRL friends that were?
If you do know someone, ask them what they think.
I haven't heard the show, so I can't comment on it specifically. I will listen to it. A good friend of mine did listen to it and we tried to talk about it. I lost my mind when he told me the gist of the program was creating a storyline that suggested his desertion was somehow justified. Having said this, I paid some attention to this story while it was going on, so I am familiar with the history. The spin on it began well before the docudrama you heard.

This sorry bag of meat air thief wants everyone else to be responsible for his sorry ass. The real shame is he made it back when some of his brothers in arms did not. Trying to get non-military to understand this is akin to trying to get someone outside of our sport to understand motorcycle racing.

Joe

 

Dart,
I just reread what I wrote. It is not meant to be an attack on you. Please don't take it as such.
My questions are genuine. Not challanges.

Joe

 

Nope should have left him in the combat zone to rot. I don't even believe his tales of torture or well anything he says. I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire but I might spare a gallon of gas to the cause.

 

The above replies have already more than handled this, but...

Who's hands do you suppose he was going end up in while deserting in the middle of Afghanistan? And he knew it. Anyone there wearing a US uniform and wandering off alone is basically surrendering to the enemy. What part about that don't you understand?

And you saying that "he did not deliberately put himself in enemy hands"? You do not know that. You're putting an awful lot of trust into a podcast.

 

The guy is a useless asshole, I agree. If he gets thrown in Leavenworth for life or gets shot, or gets acquitted I really don't care. However, I think the story is bigger than one man. What about the institutional failures that led the Army to take this guy to Afghanistan? I'm positive the warning signs were there. Didn't the Army fail its soldiers as much as this guy failed his buddies? Why take a useless malcontent to the combat zone? I know we need bodies but seems like that's the kind of body everyone is better off without even if you end up short a dude. Why is the Army so intent on retaining useless people?

This reminds me a bit of good ol' Major Nidal Hassan or whatever his name is. The guy gives every sign needed that he needs to be booted from the Army but no one does anything. The military and and government at large are totally feckless.

 

I'm not sure how many of you have actually served in the military so I will only address those of you that have not. Not everyone is cut out to be in the military and life in that kindly institution can get rather harsh. I obviously do not know the man but I can just about tell you that we members of the general public are not included in the group that is privy to whatever the military intelligence has learned.

Just from his actions I would venture out to bet that his intention was to gain some public outcry in order to go over his commanding officer's head. I would also bet that he figured that he was going to go for a walk until his absence was noticed, then come strolling back into camp thus getting his ass thrown on the carpet and allowing him to voice his frustrations with their, or his, mission.

I guess what I should say is that we need to back off and wait until we find out some facts with the case. Let's not condemn him yet until we know what exactly he was trying to do and why.
Just saying.

 

This is gonna be my last comment and then I'll just laugh at most of the responses that actually think this guy was trying to get attention. Speaking from personal experience since I'm in the military, no matter how stupid shit gets, you suck it the fuck up. This dude is going to get crucified in court. There is no case. I work with a guy who was in his unit. He's a self centered ass hole who didn't have the balls to speak up for himself. If a fucking private has an issue with a commanding officer, its cause he already did something to fuck up. The guy deserted his post, got soldiers killed, fed intel to the Taliban, and of course we exchange him for 5 key leaders. The guy only ranked up because of the army's promotion system. He didn't earn his stripes. He's a fucking traitor. There's no arguing that because it is a FACT


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Yes, yes, and yes. I was, I did, and I have. I was even born on a military base.

I'm not saying it was justified. Not in my mind. It was incredibly stupid and misguided - I even said so in one of my other posts.

It was justified in his mind. He wasn't right for being in a team or in a combat environment with a bunch of other guys that depended on him. The army should have never put him there.

It absolutely was his fault he was captured. But, it absolutely should have never happened.

There's lots of spin on all sides.

• The Army is/was interested in avoiding the embarrassment with this whole thing. They knowingly took a guy with a mental disorder and depression, who'd been found blacked out, in a fetal position, with a bloody nose (self inflicted) in Coast Guard boot camp, and subsequently discharged.
• The Army perpetuated a lie that 6 soldiers died looking for him. They discuss this in the story. All of them were killed later, and on different missions. But, they all died bravely and got medals.
• The government wanted to avoid embarrassment associated with a botched negotiation that actually started as an end to the war in Afghanistan, but ended up taking 3 more years (they had an agreement in 2011 that didn't involve anyone from Guantanamo, and was more about a cease fire than it was about an exchange). There's a lot more to this one, but suffice it to say, there was a bit of sabotage from people who didn't want Bergdahl back.
• The White House and their Rose Garden ceremony was a list minute PR stunt/photo op. Referring to Bergdahl as a "hero" was also a fuck up from someone who was improvising because she wasn't good in public speaking situations.
• There could be spin from Bergdahl himself, although I don't see why. I mean, shit, they had to teach the guy how to sleep in a bed again. He couldn't even speak when they picked him up - he literally hadn't spoken English (or any) words in a couple of years and had been living in a cage. To be honest, a prison cell would probably feel better to him than walking down a city street and being harassed, or attending a sporting event with thousands clapping when his picture goes up on the jumbotron

I also recognize that his life, in large part, is basically forfeit at this point. I mean, he really has not been in control of anything that happens to him since that night in 2009. That's a long freaking time to be out of control. I'm certain he has psychological issues beyond what he carried as baggage entering the Army. I really don't know how he has much quality of life at this point. Then again, they don't go into what he's been doing since he got back stateside.

 

We're good, man. I don't take much here personally. I was military, and I definitely get it. If someone had deserted my unit, especially if we were in a hostile place and it put us in more danger, I'd be pissed too.

Had I not just listened to the entire story, from all angles, I'd probably feel differently. I'm not so much sympathetic to the guy, but I'm not ready to burn him at the stake without holding the Army and the U.S. Government accountable for their roles in this. They both fucked up too.

 

Do you realize until they recovered him and taught him to speak again, they had no idea whether he'd been kidnapped or not? I don't know how you could say that.

As I said earlier, scars don't lie. Unless he's a brilliant actor, SERE psychologists don't lie either.

 

I will agree with you that he is most likely to be nailed to the cross over this. And I also agree that when you're in the military you just "suck it up" and deal with what hand you're dealt. I also remember when I was in the Army there were a couple of guys in my basic training company that were yo yos that ended up getting discharged because they just didn't "fit the military" life. One of the was kind of like Bergdahl. The little creep disappeared one morning and was reported AWOL. The little bastard was living under the barracks building. Four frigging days living there. He had no mental capacity to deal with the pressure of basic.

I'm more than willing to let the feathers settle wherever with Bergdahl. Nothing we/I can do about it.

 

So a couple failures out of how many? Institutional failure is BS the army does an awesome job not only with the many spectacular people but also with some malcontents that are fixed.

 

These are just the ones people know about.

According to the story, 2 or 3 others have done it since Bergdahl, and I have to believe others have done it before. You just heard about him because of the media access they have now. One guy was going to hike/backpack/hitchhike his way to Eastern Europe. No lie.

I am personally aware of multiple suicide attempts - some successful, some not, by service members on active duty as well. People respond and break in different ways. Hell, we weren't even in a war zone and a guy cracked - rushed the gate at USSTRATCOM and got the SPs to shoot him.

 

Another one....http://www.reuters.com/article/us-hawaii-security-idUSKBN1A70M8

 

As told by NPR? Fiction.

 

Oh good, then if it's fiction, those who cried "traitor" can rest easy. It never happened.

 

You realize that if you had 10000 examples it would still be less than 1% correct?

It is not perfect and the suicide thing sucks and yes could/should/can be improved. However to say institutional failure when there is so much right is just wrong. For every case you cite there is a ton more that are about the persons success that was helped in part by their service. Is the VA a crime, yes. Do I wish for the military to have fewer suicides than the general population, yes. However on that one given the stress of the job it is unlikely to ever occur. Should we as a country help those who have served transition to civilian life, hell yes. Is the military perfect, nope like everything else there is always room for improvement.

Oh and Bergdahl is still a puke.

 

Sounds like we should just send him back so justice could continue to be served.

 

So, now you're advocating leaving a man behind?