Federal Judges Need To Be Reigned-In

Discussion in 'The Dungeon' started by In Your Corner, Feb 28, 2019.

  1. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    The parents are an American and an Israeli who used a surrogate mother. Please stop making up shit.
     
  2. R Acree

    R Acree WTF

    Does the article state the nationality of the mother? All I saw was that the twins were born in Canada.
     
  3. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    Good point, she might not have been Candian. It is pretty easy to assume she wasn't a US citizen though.
     
  4. R Acree

    R Acree WTF

    Assuming the surrogate was not a US citizen, one kid was automatic. The other not so much by the classic criteria.
     
  5. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    After a quick check - the law says nothing about surrogates, only discusses parentage. One parent is a US citizen and child is born to an alien then kid is a citizen. Does not require a DNA test to prove anything. Does not say word one about sperm donation or the like. Does not specify what it means by parent.

    Nothing that says kid a should have been treated differently than kid b. Nothing about the parents marriage status either. Everything says if one parent is a citizen then the kid is - so both kids are citizens. Easy peasy.
     
  6. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    Hmmmmm.... found another site done by the State Department, back in a bit :D
     
  7. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    Acquisition of U.S. Citizenship by a Child Born Abroad


    Birth Abroad in Wedlock to Two U.S. Citizen Parents
    A person born abroad in wedlock to a U.S. citizen mother and a U.S. citizen father acquires U.S. citizenship at birth under section 301(c) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA), if one of the parents has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions prior to the person’s birth.

    NOTE – MEANING OF “IN WEDLOCK”: a person is considered to be born in wedlock for the purposes of citizenship acquisition when the genetic and/or gestational parents are legally married to each other at the time of the person’s conception or birth or within 300 days of the termination of the marriage by death or divorce, and both parents are the legal parents of the child under local law at the time and place of birth.

    Birth Abroad in Wedlock to a U.S. Citizen and an Alien
    A person born abroad in wedlock to a U.S. citizen and an alien acquires U.S. citizenship at birth if the U.S. citizen parent has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions prior to the person’s birth for the period required by the statute in effect when the person was born (INA 301(g), formerly INA 301(a)(7).) For birth on or after November 14, 1986, the U.S. citizen parent must have been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for five years prior to the person’s birth, at least two of which were after the age of fourteen. For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, the U.S. citizen parent must have been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for 10 years prior to the person’s birth, at least five of which were after the age of 14 for the person to acquire U.S. citizenship at birth. The U.S. citizen parent must be the genetic or the gestational parent and the legal parent of the child under local law at the time and place of the child’s birth to transmit U.S. citizenship.

    Birth Abroad Out-of-Wedlock to a U.S. Citizen Father – “New” Section 309(a)
    A person born abroad out-of-wedlock to a U.S. citizen father may acquire U.S. citizenship under Section 301(c) or 301(g) of the INA, as made applicable by the “new” Section 309(a) of the INA if:

    1. A blood relationship between the person and the father is established by clear and convincing evidence;
    2. The father had the nationality of the United States at the time of the person’s birth;
    3. The father (unless deceased) has agreed in writing to provide financial support for the person until the person reaches the age of 18 years, and
    4. While the person is under the age of 18 years --
    • the person is legitimated under the law of his/her residence or domicile,
    • the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or
    • the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court.
     
  8. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    So now - is the State Department good with gay marriage?

    On the final section it sure seems as if the father can acknowledge paternity without a court being involved. Also looks like if the Candians put him on the birth certificate as the father then the kid would be a citizen. Wonder if thats what got the testing done in the first place?
     
  9. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    So after reading all that and reading the judges decision - I'm with the judge. The law does not require biological proof in how it is written or how it is usually enforced.
     
  10. R Acree

    R Acree WTF

    Seems like a little judicious filling in of forms could have avoided the confusion...unless the intent was to cause confusion.
     
  11. sheepofblue

    sheepofblue Well-Known Member

    "when the genetic and/or gestational parents" kid #2 genetic? no gestational? no

    But then I doubt you will be convinced that kid #2 is not due automatic citizenship.
     
  12. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    That one line out of context is not the law and in context does not supersede other portions of the law. As I said, after reading the law no, I cannot see any reason kid b would be denied citizenship. The DNA test is a moot point.

    If however, that line were the only criteria that the law specified then I'd totally agree no go on kid b in this case and dna tests for everyone who has a biological mother than is an alien and is claiming citizenship through the father.
     
  13. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    BTW - the important part of the comment you forgot to quote is "For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986"

    The gestational stuff is the old law. (309)a as I quoted above is the new law.
     
  14. Motofun352

    Motofun352 Well-Known Member

    Just what does a "blood relationship" in 309a mean to you?
     
  15. Mongo

    Mongo Sacko

    It is one method of determining citizenship, it is not the only method otherwise as with number 3 there would be an "and" at the end signifying such.
     
  16. In Your Corner

    In Your Corner It's a little-known fact...

  17. TXFZ1

    TXFZ1 Well-Known Member

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