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Another Boeing 737 Max-8 crash

Discussion in 'General' started by SPL170db, Mar 10, 2019.

  1. G 97

    G 97 Garth

    So how does Boeing proceed at this point and do they owe the effected air carriers anything while the planes are grounded? What a nightmare.
     
  2. Steak Travis

    Steak Travis Well-Known Member

    I always wondered how much hand flying they do and have sometimes thought they were on auto pilot but thought that turn was a little fast.

    The times I sat jump seat in a challenger they got on the auto pilot early but that may have been because the person in the back was scared of flying and tried to make things as smooth as possible.

    I met a united pilot Monday living in a great part of Nashville with a z71 and z06, kids through college, and flies to China a couple times a month. Doesn’t seem like a bad life.
     
    Gino230 likes this.
  3. ChemGuy

    ChemGuy Harden The F%@# Up!

    I saw some discussions about that and this is where different carriers have slightly different versions, but yes a general procedure called for reducing flaps, 1 notch I believe. The FO in colgan took them all the way up. I saw an old post where one guy posted the procedure from a different carrier. There were 2 sections depending on if ground contact was a 'factor'. A cliffs notes version:
    If not a factor apply max thrust, lower nose 5* below horizon, accelerate, arrest descent, back to normal
    If ground contact a factor: max power, adjust pitch as needed to not hit the ground, fly the damn airplane and not hit anything and NO ABRUPT control movements...keep flying the airplane until everything is cool.

    If Colgan, and others had things like pitch up at stick shaker..someone needs their heads examined. Now somehting like add power adjust pitch to not crash into the ground..that would work too.
    But this wouldnt be the first time some manual was effed up and written by engineers or lawyers or god only knows....

    Payne Stewarts crash would have most likely been avoided if the idtios had written the QRH like...
    cabin pressure alarm
    Step 1---MASK ON
    Step 2---What ever...just put your mask on then figure out what broke

    Instead it was
    Step 1--- switch this switch to here and check for this and that and .....oh why cant i see so well....maybe im hypoxic..wow thats a funny word...wait what....i was doing something....sleepy....time to go night night.....
     
  4. Dave Wolfe

    Dave Wolfe I know nuttin!

    I think the imminent stall recovery maneuver was part of the practical test standards at the time. It was a pretty universal maneuver regardless of aircraft primarily meant to demonstrate competancy. However these things become automatic responses when things go wrong, for better or worse.
     
  5. HPPT

    HPPT !!!

    The last estimate I saw before the US fleet was grounded was that it was going to cost them something like $10 million a day. They will have to reimburse all the operating airlines for the leasing costs on replacement airplanes until they can get theirs back into the air. They had the same problem a few years ago when the 787 was grounded after a series of fires.
     
    G 97 likes this.
  6. Motofun352

    Motofun352 Well-Known Member

    OK, just to clarify since you seem to want to be argumentative.....They (Ethiopia) refused to send the boxes to the US where the information would already be down loaded...instead "they" sat on it for 3 days until they finally figured out they couldn't deal with it...WTF! Quite clear that they didn't have to technical where with all from the get go. Why? Next "they" decided to send the information to Europe...coincidence? As I write this the US has not been invited to participate (both FAA and Boeing)...again, why? It smells fishy. I have no problem with the info being down loaded in Europe as long as the FAA and Boeing has access to it and can evaluate the results.
    I ask, How do you think the results will be viewed if they don't participate? Will it be a political answer meant to bolster Airbus at the expense of Boeing and the US?
     
  7. SPL170db

    SPL170db Trackday winner

    EDIT: already posted
     
  8. HPPT

    HPPT !!!

    Jurisdiction is typically shared between the country where the aircraft is registered and the country where the accident occurred. They don't have to give shit to Boeing or the FAA. In addition, there is a strong incentive to have people who don't have anything to protect to be the only ones to look at the data. Boeing will be involved when they decide it's time to get going involved. I am open to a friendly wager on that.

    Where does the grounding of the airplane by the United States fit in your Airbus/China conspiracy theory? And did you know that Airbus and many large European suppliers have a strong disincentive to see production stop? Did you know, for instance, that the airplane uses French engines and tires?
     
  9. G 97

    G 97 Garth

    I suppose one could also make the claim that the FFA didn’t ground the 737 because its Boeing.

    Just from being on the way outside and looking in, I think the other countries and now Trump, did the right thing in grounding the plane. Better safe than sorry.
     
  10. HPPT

    HPPT !!!

    Yup, if there was any politics involved in this, that's where it happened. Not in Europe or China. Nevermind that the plane was first grounded by Ethiopia, Indonesia and Australia.
     
  11. Newsshooter

    Newsshooter Well-Known Member

    I also heard Boeing wanted the grounding in the US before it was announced by trump.
     
  12. G 97

    G 97 Garth

    No idea but Boeing can make the call themselves to ground any of their planes. I’m sure they were in contact with each other on some level. I would hope anyway.
     
  13. baconologist

    baconologist Well-Known Member

    But Boeing can’t stop foreign flaged a/c from entering the US
     
  14. dieterly

    dieterly Well-Known Member

    I know some Asian airlines want the maximum use of the A/P, but that’s probably a good thing considering the experience level in the cockpit....
     
  15. dieterly

    dieterly Well-Known Member

    How many hours do you have in an Airbus?
     
  16. notbostrom

    notbostrom DaveK broke the interwebs

    Ims sure Boeing's lawyers didn't want them grounding their own planes and admitting fault in a defacto manner
     
  17. G 97

    G 97 Garth

    They did it before just a few years ago on the 777. Better to be proactive. De facto default by grounding them is sort of a moot point when you have multiple carriers already grounding them plus instances of planes falling out of the sky. Something isn’t right, whether it be mechanical or training issues.
     
  18. notbostrom

    notbostrom DaveK broke the interwebs

    Honestly I just wanted to use the word defacto in a post.......


    But yeah good points
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
    G 97 likes this.
  19. Spang308

    Spang308 Well-Known Member

    :crackup:
     
  20. auminer

    auminer Renaissance Redneck

    D sepsis will be along shortly to point out that you didn't spell it correctly...
     
    pickled egg likes this.

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