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MotoAmerica | 2022 | Round 3 | Michelin Raceway Road Atlanta | Braselton | April 22 - 24

Discussion in 'General' started by henry_carlson, Apr 22, 2022.

Page 25 of 37
  1. dieterly

    dieterly Well-Known Member

    He also had an opinion about the “ rule controversy”, sounds like he would just had accepted race directions correct call, but then again, he has tons of experience in pro racing.
     
    dieterly, Apr 30, 2022
    #481
  2. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    Everything I'm hearing is there was a flag at T9 - which makes all of the rest of the discussion a moot point on being able to see it and so on.

    Also keep in mind the officials have a TON more video and camera angles than the finished production stuff that is online.
     
    Mongo, Apr 30, 2022
    #482
    Nathey, Gino230, cBJr and 1 other person like this.
  3. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    No I will not. I want the option to tell riders something is happening ahead of you so don't freak or target fixate but you also don't have to do anything different this lap than any other. Could be a crash off track, could be a critter sitting next to the track staring at you, could be a slow rider ahead of you. If we need to control what is happening in that corner by the riders still racing we have that option with the waving yellow.
     
    Mongo, Apr 30, 2022
    #483
    cav115, 5axis and Once a Wanker.. like this.
  4. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    Watching oncoming traffic is more important than running at the time of that pic.
     
    Mongo, Apr 30, 2022
    #484
  5. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    But you think you're calm and stable too :D
     
    Mongo, Apr 30, 2022
    #485
    Once a Wanker.. and GNC like this.
  6. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    So just to add another point of view the boss and I talked about yesterday.

    Flag is out in T9 and T10a. No passing zone is from the station at T9 until the next flagging station at T11 just past the bridge. Not seeing the flags is no longer something to discuss, like it or not the riders need to pay enough attention to see the flag stations - especially two in a row. I could possibly forgive the T10a sightlines in a pack like that but two in a row nope. Especially when battling that closely, the danger increases and the riders must be more aware not less.

    Some riders passed, some did not. Should the riders who followed the rule properly be penalized for following the rule? Because that is what would have happened. Riders following the rules would have lost the spots they earned by following the rulebook. I'm sure no one would find that acceptable.

    I personally think the biggest issue is a huge number of people including the riders didn't know the rules. That isn't good either, everyone needs to read every word of every rulebook where they plan on racing so they're not caught out in a mistake like this. No, I do not think there was any willful breaking of rules on anyones part, yes they all raced great. But when it comes down to it you cannot try to be fair to all because quite simply someone is getting fucked over in a situation like this. So you have to enforce what the book says.

    Again - I am NOT truly faulting any of the riders. It's a sucky situation for everyone involved but the rules do need to be enforced. If you don't like the rules then so be it, work towards changing them for the future but that doesn't affect what has to happen at the time.

    Knowing all of them they'll get over it if they aren't already and go back to riding their asses off. They definitely handled it better than adults would have.
     
    Mongo, Apr 30, 2022
    #486
    G Dawg, KMC, Gino230 and 4 others like this.
  7. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    FWIW 10b is not for us or any org I know a flagging station, it is pickup on riders left before the bridge. There is no one permanently stationed riders right before the bridge as it is in the runoff for 10a. Remember Mladin and no brakes?
     
    Mongo, Apr 30, 2022
    #487
    G 97 likes this.
  8. GNC

    GNC Jim Rashid

    I just try to be like you ! have a great day.
     
    GNC, Apr 30, 2022
    #488
  9. GNC

    GNC Jim Rashid

    when I worked tech I always told racers or crew , show me in the rulebook where it says whatever they were bitching about. If the didn't have a rulebook I handed them one.
     
    GNC, Apr 30, 2022
    #489
    Once a Wanker.. likes this.
  10. Knarf Legna

    Knarf Legna I am not Gary Hoover

    All good points. FWIW none of the three teams who went to the tower were there to protest, we were there to understand the reason for the penalties. Gus did not pass anyone until the exit of 10b, which would have been at the green flag that we were told was there, so we believed he should not have been penalized. Maybe we all misunderstood what we were told and shown in the sketch. I doubt that there's any team in the paddock that knows the location of every flag station, maybe that's something that we should know in the future.
     
    Knarf Legna, Apr 30, 2022
    #490
    TurboBlew and GNC like this.
  11. assjuice cyrus

    assjuice cyrus Well-Known Member

    Kinda like the Blake thing at dayton. Alot of talking after words of people,teams,and riders all saying they didn't know about the the race control loosing site of crashed rider would get you d.q. Live and learn. I agree,they handled it better then most adults.
     
    assjuice cyrus, Apr 30, 2022
    #491
  12. 83BSA

    83BSA Well-Known Member

    Sheesh. The world must be ending . . . I find myself acknowledging that Mongo's statement is cogent, articulate, accurate and well reasoned. What is happening?

    Cheers,

    Dave
     
    83BSA, Apr 30, 2022
    #492
    Gino230 and Once a Wanker.. like this.
  13. cBJr

    cBJr Well-Known Member

    Thank you for a well thought out reply to this situation. It’s good to hear what a rulemaker thinks. It is funny that both the riders and the rulemakers should have done a better job reading the rules here.

    I agree that a flag at T9 negates all of my complaints. I watched the broadcast and tried to step through the video but could not see any yellow flags from those angles. That said it was all pretty blurry so I had a hard time making out exactly where the flag station is. Like I said in my first post I think it’s good that they’re strict to safety rules especially for the younger riders so that the have safety paramount in their minds.
     
    cBJr, Apr 30, 2022
    #493
  14. noles19

    noles19 Well-Known Member

    TBH that's a very normal rule in car and bike racing I'm surprised people didn't know it
     
    noles19, Apr 30, 2022
    #494
    Scott S. likes this.
  15. Scott S.

    Scott S. Well-Known Member

    Thank you!
     
    Scott S., Apr 30, 2022
    #495
  16. Inquizid

    Inquizid Member Well-Known

    Still baffled there is an adult in the mix, but I suppose rules are rules.
     
    Inquizid, May 1, 2022
    #496
  17. 5axis

    5axis Well-Known Member

    5axis, May 1, 2022
    #497
    Scott S., G 97 and Once a Wanker.. like this.
  18. Once a Wanker..

    Once a Wanker.. Always a Wanker!

    In-depth discussion...
     
    Once a Wanker.., May 1, 2022
    #498
  19. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    Yep, totally understand what you guys were doing and have to say I'm actually pretty impressed with the restraint of the race parents et al.

    The teams really don't need to know the flag stations but the riders absolutely should especially by Sunday.
     
    Mongo, May 2, 2022
    #499
  20. Mongo

    Mongo Administrator

    I'm not sure any racer is an actual adult...but I was referring in the case specifically to those penalized, not to the field as a whole. I believe the riders are all under 18 but could be wrong, I'm horrible with ages.
     
    Mongo, May 2, 2022
    #500
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