Difference between novice and experts

Have you noticed how the WERA top "novices" are running the same times as the experts?

Look at the 600 and 750 novice and expert times in superstock and you will see the top novices are running mid-pack to top 5 expert times. Why doesn't WERA force the those "experts" who like to run in the novice group to actually register as experts. I'm sure those guys like to register novice so they can finish up front and get contigency money. If WERA did that, maybe more people would get into racing because the novice group really would be novices not a bunch of experts masquarading as novices. Plus, it would make things safer for the novice grids with smaller grids and less speed variation.

 

uh oh.... be nice Mongo.

 

Lap times alone do not earn you expert status.

Enter a couple of races or at least go to the track on a race weekend and you'll soon figure that out.

Later,

 

dude what are you on. geoff doyer, chad larsen spent most of thier time doing track days, this is their first race seasonson so why steal their time to shine and run their races! they will get moved in time. being a expert isnt about how fast you go! it's alot more than that.

the grid will never be smaller in the 600 class it wont happen!

 

1fast929,

this is my first year racing and i used to think the same thing until i gut my butt on the track. besides turning a fast lap there is a lot of other things to consider. For ONE being able to pass someone in a safe manner! or being consistant and turning a fast lap without crashing every other race. we just need experience. I can say this now that anything can happen out there. my first two races i was literally side swiped, once at summit and VIR. Its part of racing....don't worry OUR TIME WILL COME

 

Oh no you didn't

 

Re: Re: Difference between novice and experts

dude - I don't even know who geoff doyer or chad larsen are. Don't try and make my observations an attack on anybody. I was just simply asking a question based on some observations that I made looking at mylaps.com. Oh btw, I can also name off 4 or 5 top 10 novices that have been racing for years that don't want to register expert because they lose out on contingency money.

I am not saying 600 grids have to be smaller, but lets be real - if there was less speed variation between the fastest novices and the true novices that would make the grids safer.

 

Let's see I have done trackdays at Taladega, Barber, Road Atlanta, North Florida, Roebling Road, when I lived in Europe I did trackdays at Spa, Le Mans, Neuremburg Ring, and I have been riding and racing off and on both dirt and track for the past 25 years. Does this mean that I am allowed to ask a question?

 

This it true of ANY sport. The top 10 college hoop stars are in the top 20% in the NBA. It is the same with CCS as well. The top 5 Busch riders would be top 20 in NASCAR day one. I can't think of any sport where this is not true. Come race and then worry about that shit.

 

by all means yes you are but the second half of that post looked more like a statement/sugestion to me!

 

Half the top-5 in a busch race usually are Cup drivers .... cherrypicking

- Roach

 

snivel, snivel, snivel. there will always be someone faster. i can't believe all the crying i've heard this year. he should be an expert this...... he should be an expert that... next year there will be some other kid to come thru and be faster as well. we should all just sit back and enjoy watching these kids do stuff we can only dream about doing. i've got the best seat in the house this year in bss and bsb. use the ass whippings constructivly. the faster guys only make you faster...... is'nt going faster what it's all about anyway.

 

yes Skip, it is. i like to achieve maximum velocity, before i land on my head.

 

what's your number skip!

 

Re: Re: Re: Difference between novice and experts

Wrong! I must chime in on this. I usually sit back & just read crap like this, not today!

I am a 1st year expert, 600 class, I was a two year novice both years in 600 class. I might have made $100 bucks on tire contingency in TWO years. I was not that slow but usually just out of reach of the top 5 for contingency. 2nd & 3rd wave starts until I earned enough points to move up to the 1st wave. You must crawl before you can walk.

Fast forward to this year, remember I am a 1st year expert on a brand new bike (a totally new design BTW) No I am not the fastest guy in this class, never will be (old guys have their place ) but I do race with my head. I place well, I don't crash (not that I ever did much of that anyway), I race for points & the contingency earnings so far have been good. I am where I belong. The novice class was a living nightmare but I learned alot & in the end that is what it is all about.

Sure I notice the fast novice times posted BUT take a closer look at those timing sheets. Lap for lap me or any other expert will be faster because we can do those same times lap after lap & for the most part usually by the 2nd lap. That is a little different than 1, 2 maybe 3 times a race. 1 hot lap won't do you much good in a expert race.

FWIW you don't register for a expert race, you earn it.

I could go on but this is all the time I have right now.

 

If this posts intent is to point out that many novices, stay novices for years to collect contingency and solo purses (which are large in comparison to expert solo purses) the only solution would be to double how many places the expert fields pay back and nothing for novices.
I wonder how fast the expert fields would grow then?http://forums.13x.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

 

If you dig deeper, you can see how experts generally (not always) tend to string low lap times together. Its one thing to run a 1.xx low lap time for one lap and another to do several good laps in a row, especially in traffic like someone alluded to earlier.

 

I don't think you can accumulate a lot of points as a novice year after year and have WERA permit you to remain a novice. I believe the rule is that you can request to stay a novice ONE time but after that you have to bump up to expert. All of the guys that I know that were even eligible to move to expert did so because there are much fewer crashes in the expert classes than the novice classes. Yes, the guys are overall faster but more importantly they are more relaxed, cooler, and just plain safer to ride with. And in some of the solo expert classes these guys are passing riders up to the 8th or 9th spot. They pass anywhere and closely, but since they just ride through and maintain their momentum they don't even bother me. The Expert field should have riders that are experienced...not just the isolated fast guy. I think most of the fast guys you are seeing in the novice classes are either, just talented guys that pick it up well or have had lots of experience with track clubs and are good solo riders....but MOST (there is always the exception) still need the year or two in the racing fields. I did track days for years but had to learn how to deal with the butterflies racing....in some ways the racing is completely different
Use the novice class as a barometer. Try to get started early in the season so you can move up in points. This may get some first wave starts. Go out with those guys and run a cool consistent race 'weekend' in the top 10. I think your objective should be consistently respectable lap times even in traffic. Your points will accumulate to get you in with the experts the next year. Then you will have taken control of something you think is out of control by 'graduating' from this mess you think you have. Experts have taught me more about riding smoothly than any other group. Its the nicest form of reward...progress.