School me on house or pole barn house

If you don't care you can get cheap land just hour or so outside Reno, like this 640 acre $86k. There is a lot of cheap land it that area.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/T26-R32-Sec-11-Lovelock-NV-89419/2088131830_zpid/

 

Here is 640 for 65k. You get to see water in desert
https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/...ke-Section-Lovelock-NV-89419/2093597885_zpid/

 

A mile by a mile block for 65k! It doesn't look like power is available though. I think that NV offers the ability to pull ground water for a homestead without having to own a separate water right. Thanks TWF2.

 

Yea power will be hard out there. I am not sure about water. I am on the well (300' deep) and don't remember getting any water right paperwork with house.

 

I was gonna say, beware of the noise going from asphalt roof to metal. My buddy has a 36’x24’ pole barn attached to a 50’x50’ pole barn and the noise with a decent rain is almost deafening, although it’s currently open inside. He has regular trusses 4’ on center as we don’t get a ton of snow.

His brother has a few out buildings, one which is a 40’x60’ pole barn and what a difference between his and his brother’s. He put foam board insulation in between the trusses and put a finished ceiling and walls up. One issue he is having is the ceiling will sweat with humidity and drip onto the back of the ceiling, and when I say drip.....it’s more like rain. Thus, in my construction I’m opting for the 1/4” solex insulation under the metal roof.

I think it’s so hard to insulate due to the soffit and ridge venting. But just putting a finished ceiling and some foam board insulation helped a great deal. It appears just that separation between vented “attic” and finished space really helped. It helped a lot with noise as well.
I’ve had thoughts of redoing my asphalt roof, when the time comes, on my residence to match the pole barn I’m going to build, but I’m kind of worried about the rain noise. A few local people have done this, guess I need to talk to them.



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Not a ton of functionality but you can get a high level look at what you might want by using their design program.
Wick is a top quality product. I would say industry leading.
https://wickbuildings.com/

 

Put up a solar system. Plenty of space and sunshine for it. You can build a pretty substantial system for $20k with batteries.

 

On my phone that looks like a coyote? If so, unfortunately we see them here too often. One got my dog by the neck, I heard something and ran out and scared the coyote away, but it was over $4k at the vet to save him.

 

With sheetmetal construction, it’s best to spray foam all interior surfaces. That eliminates interior sweating from two drastically different temps. And, muffles rain and wind noise.

Then, for warmth, go with a hot water heated floor. It provides an efficient, stable interior temperature, which also helps minimize sweating. If one tries to heat a sheetmetal building with torpedo or propane heaters, the combustion moisture will immediately condense on the ceiling.

 

Yeah, radiant heat would be great. The 50’x50’ pole barn is not heated as of now and in the cold times it actually gets colder than the outside. Plus working in there, laying on cold concrete really sucks!
Only issue with radiant is you’ve gotta have your lift area picked out first and you can’t deviate from that. Although you could save money on concrete and do footings for the lift, if you’re gonna be tied down to an exact spot. But that savings will be negated with the radiant cost and then boiler on top of that.
I’m doing radiant in my house, costs are pretty high. I’m hoping it pays for itself in savings.

If money was no object.....

The solex insulation under the roof really helps from what I’ve read and been told. Spray foam would be great, but then you’ve gotta finish the walls, or look at that all the time.



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Switching from shingles to metal on my layout will make no difference in either sound or sweating/raining ... I have two options , remove shingles and place metal panels on ice and water shield covered plywood. Or adding 2x4’s perpendicular to trusses on 2’ or 4 ‘ centers with 1&1/2” foam board placed in between and metal panel attached to afore said 2x4’ ...
Commonly referred to as and upside roof ...
I will most likely do option one .
Exposed metal on the inside while adding heat to building is the cause of the sweating , and your analogy to raining inside is spot on .. I’ve seen it on others ...
I am in the process of adding a ceiling to the bottom of trusses inside ..

 

Every building I know of with hot water heat, was built to a plan. If someone is going to install lifts, they pretty-much know where they’re going. You can easily leave 4’X4’ areas for lift footings/mountings. It’s no big deal.

You wouldn’t use a boiler in something like a personal home or shop. A 50gal, high efficiency hot water heater is plenty. The last building I was involved in is commercial and uses an on-demand hot water heater (not my decision). They roughly doubled their square footage (44’X74’), 2’ higher ceilings, ~4X the lighting, and reported their utility bill being ~25% of what their previous building was (~$175/mo versus ~$700/mo). We did my neighbor’s 28’X48’X10’ stick-built shop with a 40gal, conventional hot water heater (his choice), which easily handles that space.

I’m not sure the aesthetics are all that big of deal, when talking about an unfinished space. If it IS that big of deal, then, one would finish it out, to begin with. I’m not sure I follow your logic.

If there are any gaps at all in the insulation medium used, the sheetmetal WILL sweat. It has to be completely air tight, which is nearly impossible. Tapes and sticky strips don’t stay stuck forever, especially exposed to heat and cold. Solex is difficult to get tightly fitted and sealed around things. And, it’s not exactly cheap. It has its place, I’m just not confident in using it inside sheetmetal construction. And, I say that because of what I’ve experienced in a commercial building with exposed insulation we were called into to try and fix their constantly dripping ceiling, which we couldn’t because they didn’t want to spend the money to do it right.

 

My shop has been foamed in the walls and roof deck. It is a nice upgrade. I did finish the walls, easy 2x4 frame between the laminated beams then particle board for wall treatment.

It still gets cold in the winter in there due to no heat source but the coldest I think I’ve seen it is around 45 and that with it being zero or just under.

 

I like the idea, but I have to be able to weld, so I don't think it feasible.

Hadn't considered much of that. So you are saying that the best and most durable method is to spray? I've seen restaurants with sprayed ceilings and exposed supports etc. They painted those items, usually black, then made other items in a bright metal finish. It looks mod/industrial. I liked it a lot.

 

Back to the OP's original question - the biggest challenge is getting financing for non-standard construction styles. You can run into the same issues with log construction as well - if it isn't stick and frame then banks get a little twitchy. The ratio of living space to shop space can also be an issue for valuation.

The other challenge is zoning - some municipalities forbid pole buildings for domiciles. I think that is why you see a lot of shopmahol houses built in areas without zoning requirements.

From a costs standpoint, once you finish out the living space with typically framed walls, etc you aren't going to be much cheaper by starting with a pole building. The shop portion may end up being less costly, but that is probably it.

 

IMO, you can’t beat spray foam. That stuff creates an airtight seal, everywhere it’s applied and the R-value is exceptional. Areas (nooks and crannies) one might not bother addressing with conventional insulation, a shot from the foam gun seals it.

Some types (closed-cell) are impervious to mildew, so much more versatile for areas where moisture might be an issue.

Research the stuff. There are a variety of spray foams councils, coalitions, and groups with informative websites.

The initial application figure is going to be higher than conventional methods. However, the longer-term savings and more stable interior temperatures will be the payoffs.

 

Yea, they have den here and walk through yard every day. I do like hearing them sing at night

 

What he said. Spray foam is very nice. Im not a fan of 1/2lb or any open cell foam for residential insulation. Pay a little more and get 2lb closed cell. If you wnat to get the benefit at a lower cost get a contractor to do a flash layer (maybe 1") of spray foam then fill the cavity with fiberglass or other cheaper insulation. That way you get the sealing effect of the spray foam and can add wires plumbing etc easier at a later date if needed, and with a lower cost than full 4in or 6in of spray foam.

And yes if you build a pole barn and live where its cold add some layer of insulation to prevent sweating.

 

I’ve learned to add extra conduits toward the attic, from the breaker box. That’ll allow for ease of circuit additions, in the future. Not a fix-all, but, at least helps with expansions, renovations, etc.

 

My wife and I really want to build a “barndominium” made with a steel structure. If we ever move from our current house that will be what we do.

I recently renovated my main floor and used spray foam on all the exterior walls and 2” in an attic space followed by blown in cellulose to make it r60 up there, r25-30 in the walls. Best thing I could’ve done. It’s more costly but the difference it made is astounding. The house is much quieter and there’s no drafts. The walls are warm to the touch even when it’s -15°c outside.

If it costs $10k more to do spray foam when/if we build, I wouldn’t even blink when signing the cheque.