How to feel more comfortable hard braking

the method is your legs & core. You should usually be set for the upcoming corner with your legs.
If youre using your arms to brace or hold on... then youre doing it wrong.
you can also "step" your seat/tail section so you have a reference to let you know where youre at on the bike. Though some riders prefer a superbike tail with a pad because they can feel what the rear wheel/back end is doing better than a stock seat.

 

wheres @slimjim00 ???

 

Ken Hill was discussing about this a year ago when I was taking a class. He also covers it in his podcast.

Your outer leg's inner thigh is pressed against the back of the tank. That's what keeps you from moving forward without squeezing the tank.

Your hands are going to take a load in the braking zone, there's no way around it. The leg dangle definitely increases the load on your hands. Your core is working to keep too much pressure on your hands, but when you're doing the hardest braking, you're definitely loaded up on all of your contact points.

 

StompGrip.

 

I could be wrong, but I don't know any pros who use the stuff and I've never personally seen the need for it.

 

I feel lost on a bike without it.

 

somethings you may just need to come full circle on? Like levers... I was a total whore for CRG type. Replaced all my controls with them... til I realized the absolute brilliance & function of stock smooth levers. Gimmicky would be the word.

 

I tried to look at WSBK action pics in search of grip products. It was difficult to find a clear shot of a tank inside a knee. Of the two I found, both had a grip product. I didn't look too hard.
I did not look at static bike pics...they're for the magazines, all glossy and shiny.

I did...then I kept going, passed Go, collected 200 hundred dollars and put StompGrip back on the bike. Could'nt be any less stressed or worn out physically unless I just quit riding at levels that require hard and heavy brake usage.

With ya on stock levers...there's no substitute.

 

What stock levers? The ones on my Tuono are different from the ones on my R1 and SV. On the track bikes I run Magura brake levers, but that is just to go with he Magura MC.

Not having a grip product on the tank sucks a lot on the R1, less so on the SV, but still better with it.

 

Doesn't matter. Ergos for every bike are different. Levers match the bike's ergos. Start swapping things out and it all changes. Then you get to change the rest of the bike until everything feels right again. Levers would be the last thing I would ever change unless I knew I was looking for a particular feel or function at my fingertips, like OEM shorties or somethin'.
If you're diligent about researching products, and get lucky, the choice(s) you made works out for you.

FWIW, I do not consider Maguras an OEM, nor Brembos, but I would not hesitate to consider either, particularly, Maguras. I realize both brands have become OEM offerings.

 

I remember that podcast. It made perfect sense as I listened to him. And while you do want to use your legs and core while braking, the more I study and learn, it seems that your hands will take some load under hard breaking. It's just that it should be shared with legs and core. Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems the message to riders had gotten lost and somehow turned into not having weight on your hands while braking. Is that even possible?

 

I'm an amateur trackday rider at best, lets get that out of the way.

My understanding is that the hardest braking, you're loaded up all over the thing and the steering will be relatively locked out from responding to the track surface because you're supporting your body. As you trail off the braking force and steer the bike into the corner, the closer you get to maximum lean the less braking and weight on the steering input you want to be doing so that the front can move with the surface.

I'm struggling with this last part due to overall fitness. I cannot properly unload my arms and load up my core/inner leg to support my body weight while leaned over and transitioning from trail braking to getting back on the throttle and I'm putting in unwanted steering inputs.


Someone like Robert will come in and correct us though. Putting out the wrong information on the internet is the surest way to get the correct information after all!

 

close enough

braking with lean causes a torque on the steering head. more lean angle or more braking force increases this torque. braking while turning left causes the front tire to try to turn left. this is the opposite direction of counter steering, so the bike will stand up - unless you resist this with your arms. this adds to why the bars can feel locked. I generally try to minimize the force I need to put into the bars. because this torque increase with lean angle, itll take less force to turn the bike if I do it early and smoothly. later corrections to add lean angle while still on the brakes use a ton more effort. corrections to remove lean angle while still on the brakes should use no effort because this torque can do it for u.

for anyone:
I think a lot of racers can unload the bars enough, they just don't. next time in a long corner, try moving your inner elbow around. flap your arm. doing so should cause you to relax and unweight that bar. if your lower body doesnt shift, you are locked in and supported - u were just trying too hard with that inside arm. if your lower body does shift, get some tank pads or something.

 

Chicken dance! I try to do it at least once on the warm up lap to re-enforce staying loose.

 

Yep I rode out a tire snake once this summer and it was in a slow corner too. Nearly put me down. Lesson learned. Pay more attention

 

My bars aren't locked completely, I can still move them quite easily and flap my elbow. But I can't take either hand off the bars at lean because I'm still pressing into both to support myself. It's quite concerning from a rider development standpoint. But I'm also not braking anywhere near hard enough into braking zones or on the meat of the tire +/- 30 degrees off center to actually lock the bars hard and I'm trailing off to really light braking very early.

 

Sigh........short version -

Your hands/arms are absolutely loaded during braking. Not locked, but close.
You don't squeeze the tank during braking.
You use the palms of your hands to support yourself under hard braking.
You transfer that weight from hands/arms to your core at turn in via the outside thigh that is already engaged and your inside foot.
We use a stomp grip type of product.
WSBK/MotoGP nearly all have ergonomics custom tailored for them.

Ken

 

Boom.

 

I've been doing it all wrong.. :facepalm

 

you're even pressing on the outside bar mid-corner? when not braking? weird. ive never heard of anyone doing that.