I have ridden bikes for years, and did some Track days on my F4i last year, but had a close call and decided I'd get a cheap track bike that I could get started racing on and not risk the nice street bike. So, I am looking to buy a 600cc racebike($2500 to$3000). I have found a number of GSXR's, F3's, ZX6r's pretty close to this. The cleanest one by far I have found is a 97 YZF600r. I know it is slightly down on HP and heavier, but how much does it matter on lap times? Thanks for any input.
Do you want to win or have fun? (do you have to win to have fun?) F3 or YZF is plenty for what I do....but I don't shoot for the box.
Winning isn't everything(?) Fun is definately more important at this point. If winning was, I'd have to spend more. Just really wanted to get an idea of how far off these other bikes it would be. The YZF is super clean, but that only offsets performance so much, and I was trying to get a better handle on what the perf diff was.
Hey Jack, I have an '01 YZF600R that I will be racing in the north central region this year. I have done a number of track days at Putnam, the last time out with a laptimer. I was posted times in the 1:21 - 1:23 range. That is nowhere near the front, but I don't think its embarassing either. I think more depends on the rider than the bike, I did a two-up ride with Jason Pridmore on a Katana 750 and we were killing everybody through the turns. I wanted to start off with a bike that was familiar to me, so I converted my streetbike into a racer. Right now my laptimes aren't limited by the bike, but my own ability. When I can ride this bike balls out I might look for something with more oomph.
Ability....... Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. A good clean bike with no obvious problems and not drop a bunch of cash until I can really ride the sh@# out of it.
I do track days on a '93 Seca II with street tires and have consistent 1:22's-25's at Putnam Park. I have timed almost every WERA race at PP and there are about 4-5 classes where I wouldn't finish last. The YZF600R should do a good job of getting you started. So, buy what you can, talk to guys in the pits, ride smart (within your limits) and have fun!
I raced a 95 YZF in 2001 and 02, best lap time I ever acheived was a 1:19 at Putnam and that took some serious ass puckering effort. To contrast that, this year I have an 02 GSXR 600 and I can run 1:19's all day without cracking a sweat. Buy something lighter, like an F3. You might even find an F4 or an older GSXR in the 3000 range. This is merely my opinion
There is something to be said about getting another F4i You could pickup a salvaged or untitled CBR for around that much, maybe even an already race prepped one if you find the right deal. It would simplify your parts and familiarity issues, and give you a ready supply of spares for one or the other...
Don't know where you got that, but it's not really true....Humans don't make 1hp and they can move significantly more than 7-8 lbs. of mass. If people could generate 1hp, then they'd be able to burn 640 calories in one hour. (Assuming you could get 100% efficiency!) It is said that dropping 7-8 lbs. of weight is "worth" 1hp...but no one has ever been able to show me the math on this. (And that only applies to acceleration, not top speed.)
With the new rules allowing head milling, go ahead and run the YZF. They are dead stable in any corner,and you could always pray for rain like we did when we had them.
I'll give it a try, the math seems straightforward. If you don't like math just skip to the end. The formula for power is: (eq.1) P = F * d / t where P=power, F=force, d=distance, t=time. Suppose we fix distance to be a constant, then we can solve the equation for time as: (eq.2) t = k * (P/F); where k = 1/d What's to notice is that with respect to time, Power and Force is inversely proportional. That is what P/F says. Force here is just weight (mass * gravity.) In other words, if you double the weight, you must also double the power to get the same time. Make sense. How did we get 1 hp = 8 lbs? Well we can work backwards. In English, we can say, "if we reduce the power by 1 hp, it must equal in ratio if we add the weight by 8 lbs." In math we can write it as: (eq.3) (h-1)/f = h/(f+8) With basic algebra we can cross-multiply and simplify: (eq.4) fh= (h-1)*(f+8) = hf-f+8h-8, or (eq.5) h= (f+8) / 8 It tells us that the 1 hp = 8 lbs is only true when the horsepower to total weight ratio satisfies eq.5, which is 1:8 anyway. A real world possibility might be a 125GP bike with 41hp of power and 320 lbs total weight. We can check this against eq.3: 40/320 indeed equals 41/328. Reducing hp by 1 equals increasing weight by 8, for this bike/rider only. But few of us ride 125GP bikes with 41 hp and 320 lbs total weight. So the 1:8 ratio doesn't apply to us! What good does it do? We just need to look back to what eq.2 told us to begin with: the important part is the ratio P/F. Yes, we've just rediscovered the infamous power-to-weight ratio. To maintain performance, you need to maintain the P/F ratio of your bike, as simple as that. Say you have an R6 producing 105 hp, with the bike+fuel+rider weighing 620 lbs, that means the ratio you need to maintain is 105:620, or by dividing through, 1 hp = 5.76 lbs. Pretty simple! Anyway everyone go calculate your own power-to-weight ratios... and you'll immediately know how much weight loss equals each horsepower, for your own situation. -peekay ps. ok the real world is a bit more complex, but this is a good rough estimate.
So here on the WERA BBS you are coming out of the closet? You should probably tell your family and friends first...or go on Jerry Springer!
especially when first starting just get a bulletproof bike. i recommend an f3. ive seen them do cartwheels (while i was sliding behind it) and the thing was straight as an arrow. just pick it up and finish the race. imo, they are the best bike anyone just starting out could pick. they are friendly bikes to run. its def. more rider in the beginning. i was collecting trophies each weekend on my f3 against all new bikes, and im 200 lbs. without gear.
Anyone notice that this is an old ass thread??? I was wondering since when has Tex decided to come back on board...but his post is about 5 months old... bpoop...have you gotten that ZX-9R on the track yet. I saw you has some problems finding the ???spindle?? and ???front wheel???. Leeme know what's up...
Matt, wazzup?! I should have it going this weekend. I have track days both Sat. and Sun. Yeah, I finally got a front wheel, axle and rotor. I need to bleed the clutch and brake lines and clean out the gas tank. I hope the tranny works! How's the new house? I was waiting for pics, but gave up. Talk to you later. Keep the rubber side down. Brock
